What do you need help on? Cancel X
Bard FAQ by CaptainKO
Version: 1.04 | Updated: 12/27/07
Bard FAQ Bard FAQs created by CaptainKO Date: 3/24/07 Version 1.04 -------------------------------- ***Update*** Version 1.04 (3/24/07) Version 1.04 (3/31/07)- Updating Bard FAQ. Fixed a few grammar mistakes and spelling errors. Version 1.04 (4/4/07) – Just another update to the FAQ. -------------------------------- Table of Contents A. Attributes & Skills B. Feats C. Gameplay D. Spells E. Races F. Multi-Classing G. FAQs H. Copyright -------------------------------------------- A. Attributes & Skills Strength - (10) Strength is need for carrying items, raises you're Attack Bonus (aka AB) for melee weapons and doing more damage. The amount of weight you can carry goes up with every point of strength you receive and the damage you do with a weapon does up every 2 points for +1 to damage and attack bonus. If you have a Strength score of 10, you'll gain no benefits to damage, attack bonus and the weight you can pick is standard. If you're Strength goes below 10, you'll start to suffer -1 penalties towards AB, damage and the amount of weight you can carry with every -2 you lose. (Penalties apply to weight every point taken from strength) As a bard, a score of 10 is ideal since you are not a powerhouse. You'll be relying heavily on friends to do the real damage for you and carry the items. Dexterity - (15) + 5 Dexterity is need to raise your Reflex saves against damaging spells, raise your Attack Bonus (aka AB) for range weapons, Dexterity-based skills and traps as well as raising your Armor Class (aka AC) for a better defense. Your Reflex saves, Dexterity-based skills, Range AB and AC are raised by +1 points every 2 points of Dexterity you get. If you have Dexterity score of 10, you'll gain no benefits to your Reflex saves, Dexterity-based skills, Range AB or AC. If you're Dexterity goes below 10, you'll start to suffer -1 penalties towards Dexterity based-skills, AB with range weapons, reflex saves and AC. As a bard, a score of 15 Dexterity is ideal since you can get Two-Weapon Fighting and as well as raise your AC bonus for Mirror Image. You should raise this by +1 every four levels. Having a score of 20 dexterity will do wonders for your AC and AB. You'll also be able to get additional feats in Two-Weapon Fight category. Tumble (Dexterity-based skill): You are able to roll and save against attacks while moving. The calculation for this is Tumble DC + Dexterity + Dice Roll vs. DC of 15. Adds +1 AC Every 10 points of tumble. Sleight of Hand (Dexterity-based skill): Allows you to steal items or money off of unsuspecting people. Result vary if you are caught as not many NPC will get hostile if you fail. The calculation for this is Sleight of Hand DC + Dexterity + 1d20 vs. NPC Spot check 1d 20. It's either this skill or Appraise. Hide & Move Silently (Dexterity-based skill): These are mention Together because they are both work with stealth mode. This manual stealth is pointless because you have spell that'll turn you invisible. Parry (Dexterity-based skill): This skill allows you to go into a defensive mode to block an attack. The calculations for this is Parry DC + Dexterity vs. Enemy AB. If the roll is 5 or higher, you'll perform counter attack. You can only block and counter attack as many attacks you can perform in one round, which means you can only perform 3 successful blocks and 3 successful counter attacks. This skill is quite useful in PvP if you are dual wielding. Constitution - (14) Constitution is need to raise one's Health Points (HP), Constitution-based skills, and Fortitude saves against poison, disease, negative energy affects & death spells, attacks and traps. Your Fortitude saves, Constitution-based skills, and HP are raised by +1 every 2 points of Constitution you get. If you have Constitution score of 10, you'll gain no benefits to your Fortitude saves, Constitution-based skills, or Health points. If you're Constitution goes below 10, you'll start to suffer -1 penalties towards Fortitude saves, Constitution-based skills, and HP. As bard, a Constitution score of 14 is because having a health point rate of 8 instead of 6 or 7 is better because, you'll be required to help out at the frontlines every now and then. Concentration (Constitution-based skill): Allows you to continue casting even while being attack/damaged. The calculation for this is Concentration DC + Constitution + Dice Roll vs. 10 + Enemy Damage. This skill necessary only if plan to cast in the frontlines without protection spell. You can use Ghostly Visage, Greater Invisibility, Mirror Image, Displacement and Ethereal Visage for concealment bonuses. Intelligence - (12) Intelligence is needed to gain another skill points and raise your score for Intelligent-based skills. Your Intelligence-based skills and Intelligent-based skills are raised by +1 every 2 points of Intelligence you get. If you have Intelligence score of 10, you'll gain no benefits to your Skill points or Intelligence-based skills. If you're Intelligence goes below 10, you'll start to suffer -1 penalties towards Skill points and Intelligence-based skills. A score of 12 is ideal for to get that extra skill point for concentration. Craft Armor & Craft Weapon (Intelligence-based skill) : The bard can get someone else to do this or buy his/her equipment from a vendor. You don't need to put points towards this. Lore (Intelligence-based skill): You can identify items that appear to be unknown when taking them out of a container. This skill is boosted by Bardic knowledge. However, it's not really needed since you get spells that can help identify unknown items such Identify and Legend Lore. Spellcraft (Intelligence-based skill): This skill allows you to identify spells that are being casted. By level 20, you'll be able to identify every spell with score of 23. This also adds universal saves points towards spells. Appraise (Intelligence-based skill): The person can bargain with the shopkeeper to lower their prices. Unfortunately, it lowers the amount by a small amount. Wisdom - (10) Wisdom is need to raise one's Willpower save against mind spells, attacks & traps and Wisdom-based skills. Your Willpower saves and Wisdom-based skills are raised by +1 every 2 points of Wisdom you get. If you have Wisdom score of 10, you'll gain no benefits to your Willpower saves and Wisdom-based skills. If you're Wisdom goes below 10, you'll start to suffer -1 penalties towards Willpower saves and Wisdom-based skills. As a bard, a score of 10 is all you need for Wisdom. You don't need any additional points towards Wisdom because Willpower is one of your primary saves. It also does nothing to help your Wisdom-based skills too much either. Listen (Wisdom-based skill): This gives the bard the ability to hear anyone in stealth sneaking up on them. This'll allow you to see sneaking characters, but not invisible characters. Mildly useful unless you use amplify because most dexterity-based classes who use stealth have a score of 23 towards their Move Silently skill. Charisma- (16) Charisma is needed to raise points toward Charisma based-skills. Your Charisma based-skills are raised by +1 every 2 points of Charisma you get. If you have Charisma score of 10, you'll gain no benefits to your Charisma based-skills. If you're Charisma goes below 10, you'll start to suffer -1 penalties towards Charisma based-skills. As a bard, you only need to have 16 Charisma to cast level 6 spells at later levels. Putting additional points won't help your spellcasting much. It will increases the success of your Charisma-based skills and feats, but Charisma has no more use beyond that. Performance (Charisma-based skill): You can't be a bard without this and if you are not planning to put point towards this then you might want to roll another class instead. This allows you to play the Songs and can be used in conversation at certain points within the original campaign. Use Magic Device (Charisma-based skill): Allows you to use a magical device, use certain armor/weapon or read a scroll to cast a spell. The higher the spell, the high the UMD score is needed to qualify to use the magic item. Bluff and Diplomacy (Charisma-based skill): These skills are mainly for role-playing use only. When the option comes up, you'll be asked to come to either an agreement or playing with your enemies head by coming up with a good lie. These skills help you gain rewards without having to steal. -------------------------------------------- B. Feats - Class Feats Bardic Knowledge: This feat is gained from the start and gives your bard the ability to apply their Bard level towards their Lore score. A pure class bard can get a Lore score of 43 with this ability. Bard Music: This is the ability that makes your class what it is. As you progress through levels and put more points towards perform, you'll gain more songs and you're bonus will become more powerful. Inspirations: Inspiration allows you to buff certain aspects of your Character(s), but leave others un-buffed. For example, Inspire Courage buffs up your attack bonus and damage, but you gain no bonus to your other attributes such as saves or AC. In order to buff up your AC, you would have to switch to Inspire Defense. Inspiration cost nothing to use and they have infinite duration, though, their range is limited. Inspire Courage - Increased attack bonus and physical damage for every ally and non-combatant within range. Not necessary vital for combat, but is even with Inspire Defense. It'll become more useful after you get Curse Song. Purpose: Offensive Level 1 - +1 to Attack Bonus and Damage. Level 8 - +2 to Attack Bonus and Damage. Level 14 - +3 to Attack Bonus and Damage. Level 20 - +4 to Attack Bonus and Damage. Inspire Competence - Increases all skill points for every ally and non-combatant within range. You'll use this in a variety of situations including battle with tumble, concentration with spell casting, non-combatant situations like helping your companion boost their crafting skills or boost your chance to win a diplomacy or bluff check during conversations. Purpose: Defensive Level 2 - +2 to all skills. Level 11 - +4 to all skills. Level 19 - +6 to all skills. Inspire Defense: Add Dodge bonus AC for every ally and non-combatant within range. This inspiration is very good for melee combat, in which enemy can inflict aliments such disease or poison. (This inspiration has saved me quite a bit of trouble.) Once you get Curse Song, you might find yourself using this less. Purpose: Defensive Level 5 - +2 to AC. Level 10 - +3 to AC. Level 15 - +4 to AC. Level 20 - +5 to AC. Inspire Regeneration: Replenishes Health Points per round for every ally and non-combatant within range. There's not much use for this because after fights you can normally rest. I can only see you using this in-between fights in placing you can't rest in. Purpose: After battle in non-rest-able area. Level 7 - +1 to Health Points per round. Level 12 - +2 to Health Points per round. Level 17 - +3 to Health Points per round. Inspire Toughness: This adds points to saving throws for every ally and non-combatant within range. You'll find this useful in online servers than the original campaign. That's only if the online servers frequently put in situations where you deal with traps, spells or on-hit attacks. Purpose: Defensive Level 8 - +1 to saving throws. Level 13 - +2 to saving throws. Level 18 - +3 to saving throws. Inspire Slowing: This inspiration inflict slowness on all enemies within range. It has a DC of 13 + ½ the bard level + the Bard's Charisma vs. Will Power save. Don't judge this inspiration just yet. It can be useful in situations where you have accidently drawn too much agro to yourself from enemy NPC group and need to distance yourself from them or to trap your enemies within a Mind Fog. The Inspire Slowing feat works similar to a Web spell allow you do crowd control. Purpose: Defensive Level 11 - 15% slow movement Level 16 - 30% Slow movement Inspire Jarring: This song allows to better chances to interrupt spell casting and inflict mind-aliments. Couple with Curse Song and Mind Fog, you can greatly reduce a character's will saves allowing to successful use sleep and other mind-inflicting spells. Purpose: Offensive Level 14 - -4 to Concentration and -2 to Will power saves. - Selectable Bard Feats Battlecaster: Don't get this feat because as I noted earlier you're going to have Dexterity score of 18 for a bonus of +4 for an overall AC of 18 with a chain shirt. You'll either be wearing a light armor such as chain shirt or studded-leather armor later on. The best medium armor, breastplate gives you the 5 AC and allows for +3 Dexterity bonus, which still adds up to 18. Plus, Medium Armor puts higher penalties towards your Dexterity based skills and you'll still land an 18 AC. Lingering Song: This feat adds an additional 5 rounds to whatever Song you use. This is must for any bard build. Curse Song: This feat debuffs the enemy's AC, AB and saves. This spell works on any enemy within range of the spell. This feat is another must as it shifts the battle in favor of your allies. - General Feats Two Weapon Fighting, Two-Weapon Defense, Improve Two Weapon Fighting and Improve-Two Weapon Defense Greater Two Weapon Fighting: These feats allow you to dual wield with reduced penalties and add defense. If you're going to get Two Weapon fighting then make sure to get Two Weapon Defense and (Improve Two Weapon Defense) to increase your defense since you are going to be lacking a shield. Weapon Finesse: This feat is necessary to have affective AB using a rapier and a dagger. Great Fortitude: Add +2 to Fortitude saves. This is good to use since you have a bad Fortitude save and you lack spells that protect you from Fortitude saving spells, traps or attacks. Toughness: Gain +1 every level. This is good for Elven races. Dodge: Add +1 point to your Base AC. Good for Human races. -------------------------------------------- C. Gameplay The Class A Bard is like a Red Wizard from Final Fantasy. Their job is to support and fill in spots within a broke group. For example, if there isn't a scout-class amount, a Bard can substitute for a scout because they have the ability to go into stealth mode or they can cast invisibility on themselves. Bards can either hang out in the back row casting spells, sing or using range weapons or be in the frontlines tanking. Red Wizards of Final Fantasy did the exact same thing except they didn't have the ability to sing to boost morale. While in the frontlines, a Bard’s duty is to hold the enemy(s) until, your party members can recover from their momentum or are able to use their trump card. Pre-Battle You're buffing your teammates before the battles or you're scouting ahead using stealth mode or casting Invisibility on yourself. If an enemy is unaware of your presence you can cast sleep and later, Curse Song, Inspire Jarring, Mind fog then sleep spell for an easy Coup De Grace. Melee You're holding off the frontlines while using illusionary spells like Ghostly Visage or Mirror Image and inflicting Curse song and using offensive Inspirations like Inspire Jarring. Again, you're holding off the frontlines, you're not hacking and slashing. Don't be afraid to retreat, if you become badly wounded. You're only there to buy time for your allies. Range You're either shooting arrows/bolts, casting Ice Storm, buffing or throw out an occasional heal to your allies or using defensive Inspirations like Inspire Defense. You're not an Arcane Archer or Ranger so you shouldn’t spend all day range attacking. Strengths - Good support class can easily fill the spot of a missing class. - They have a decent AB. - They specialize in illusionary magic for defensive purpose. - Are a good "ambushing class" with mind-affecting spells such as sleep and daze. - The bard's songs and inspirations can change the balance of battle by buffing allies and debuffing enemies. - The bard's songs have effects similar to spells such Sanctuary and Spell Mantle. - Inspiration buff up your character & party’s abilities up and can be changed to match the situation. - Bards can wear almost any restricted class armor such as Monk's robes. - They are fun to roleplay. Weakness - Bards have a low Hit Dice. - Bards have a low Fort save with few spells to guard against Fort saving affects such disease or death spells. - Bards are too versatile that they specialize in nothing. - Bard have a small list of spells to choose from and not too many attack spells to be a real threat. - The DC of their spells are very low considering their Charisma doesn't go pass a score 16. - They have no strengths that would give advantage over other races and class. - They fair well in low enchantment servers, but not high enchantment servers. -------------------------------------------- D. Spells - Level 0 Spells Daze Useful in the beginning levels in stopping brute NPCs. Later on, it's useless as enemies have HD higher than a 2. Flare Useless as -1 AB won't hurt the enemy's overall AB. Cure Minor Wounds The targeted ally is healed for 4 Health Points. This spell is useless after your first level. Light This spell is useful in dark places, if you lack Darkvision as a racial ability and you don't want to hold a torch in your off-hand. Resistance This spell is not too useful, except in the beginning. - Level 1 Spell Amplify Adds +20 to Listen. Good to use in server against stealth characters or NPCs. Cure Light Wounds Targeted ally is healed for 1d8 Health Points and additional + 1 Health point per caster level for maximum of +5. This spell is useful until level 5. Identify This spell can provide useful for those early hard to Lore items, but become useless after level 5. Sleep This spell is great for ambushes on unsuspecting foes, setting them up for a Coup De Grace, which is a fatal attack that slays anyone in one melee blow. If you use a range attack from long distance or cast an attack spell, the enemy will wake up. Be careful using this spell on “DnD Hardcore rules” difficulty because it will also put you and your friends to sleep if you cast the spell while they are in range. Summon I The only summon you'll need. You'll use this spell for cannon fodder purposes such as casting your summon in front of your NPC enemies to slow them down or on a trap to trigger it. - Level 2 Spell Cure Moderate Wounds The targeted ally is healed of 2d8 Health Points and additional + 1 Health point per caster level for a maximum of +10. Useful until level 10. Ghostly Visage The first defensive spell, which will allow you to join your friends In the frontlines. It gives you a 10/+2 physical damage reduction, concealment bonus for a 50% miss chance and immunities to level 0 spells & level 1 spells. Not many NPCs have +2 enchanted weapons nor hit over 10 points of damage. Heroism This spell buffs up your attack, skills, and saves by +2 points. Very versatile buff and can be used for any situation, including battle or NPC conversations. Invisibility This basically makes you a scout and it's better than Stealth Mode because you can cast this spell anytime you like where as Stealth can only be use when the enemy isn't looking at you. Beware of enemies with the ability to see through invisibility or possess true seeing. Mirror Image This spell creates a certain number of light orbs equal to 1d4 +1 per level that orbit around your character, functioning as decoys. The AC of each decoy light orbs is 10 + your Dexterity bonus. Combined with Curse Song and Dexterity Enchantment, you're will be very defensive and there is nothing wrong with an extra defense. - Level 3 Spells Cure Serious Wounds The targeted ally is healed of 3d8 Health Points and additional + 1 Health point per caster level for a maximum of +15. Useful until level 12. Haste This spell gives you 100% movement, a fourth or fifth attack. (Depending on your class & AB) Find Traps When a Rogue isn't around, this is the spell you want to use. After the trap is discovered, throw your Summon Creature on the trap to trigger and disable it, if possible. See Invisibility This spell will allow you to see any invisible enemies within the area. See Invisibility spell is best used on a competent tank with Blind Fight as they'll be in the front and will the first to see whoever it is that is invisible in front of you. Once tank attacks the invisible target, cast mind fog and sleep in the area the tank is fighting in. Deep Slumber This spell is a better version of Sleep. - Level 4 Spells Cure Critical Wounds The targeted ally is healed of 4d8 Health Points and additional + 1 Health point per caster level for a maximum of +20. Freedom of Movement This spell is useful because you don't want to get stuck or slow down vs. vines and grease, considering your AC isn't great and your defensive spells are very limited. Greater Invisibility The spell works like invisibility, but provides a concealment bonus. This spell is good for both defensive and scouting purposes. Neutralize Poison As a bard you have poor Fortitude save and poison will either hurt your Dexterity lowering your AC and Reflex or Constitution lowering your Fortitude saves even more as well as your Health Points. War Cry The War Cry spell grants every character in the area around Bard +2 to hit and damage while every enemy in the area is feared. This spell is useful against Elven characters in PvP as sleep doesn't work against them, but useless in PvE in open areas with few mobs around. - Level 5 Spells Ethereal Visage This spell works just like Ghostly Visage except now you are immune to level 2 spells from any class and you get a physical damage reduction of 20 unless the person wield a +3 enchantment weapon. (20/+3 DR basically) By the times, you get this, most people will be wielding a +4 to +5 weapon so don't cross your fingers and I highly doubt spellcaster will be using level 2 spells. However, you still get a concealment bonus for a 50% miss. Greater Dispel This spell is useful against spellcasters with weaker spell-levels, a horrid SR and have a handful of enchantments cast on them. Greater Heroism This spell grants you or an ally a +4 morale bonus on attack rolls, saves, and skill checks as well as immunity to fear effects and temporary points equal to your level. Good to use on any of your teammates right before engaging a dragon or other monster with a fear aura. Mass Cure Light Wounds This spell heals 2d8 points of damage +1 point per caster level for maximum of +25. Mind Fog This spell inflicts -10 to will saves to any NPC enemy standing within range. Combine with Inspire Jarring OR Inspire Slowing, Curse Song and Sleep then you can put all of the enemies to sleep for a massive Coup De Grace. The grave digger will be working overtime with this spell. - Level 6 Spells Ice Storm This spell does 3d6 blunt damage + 2d6 cold damage + an additional 1d6 cold damage per 3 caster levels for a total of 6d6 cold damage. That's a possible maximum damage of 66. This spell is good to use to finish off a character in flight or to damage or kill a weak mob. Energy Immunity You are completely immune to one type of elemental attack. This spell is good to use when going up against a creature who uses one type of element when attack like a Red Dragon who uses fire breath. Mass Cure Moderate Wounds This spell heals 2d8 points of damage +1 point per caster level for maximum of +30. Mass Hold Person Good to use on a Barbarian and other class whom have or can get a Hit Dice is over 10. (Which makes it difficult to land Deep Slumber.) -------------------------------------------- E. Races The humans and Aasimar are at the top. Human get an extra feat and extra skill point for a well-balanced bard build. On the other hand, Aasimar has +2 to Wisdom and +2 Charisma, a racial damage reduction to Fire, Ice and Electrical, a free Light spell. Because you don't need a Wisdom score over 10 and Charisma over 16, the Aasimar will have more points to put towards other Attributes. Be sure to spread your points out. Remember, the bard is versatile so don't put too many points in just one attribute. Elves are good candidates with their spell immunity, saves against enchantment spells, Skill Affinities to Listen, Spot and Search and +2 to Dexterity. The -2 to Con can be overlooked and you can pick the Toughness feat to redeem the lost +1 per level, but the Elven proficiency feat is useless considering Bard can already get long swords and rapiers as part of their proficiency. And while the longbow is nice, doing 2 extra points of damage isn't a big deal considering, Bards aren't good at range no more than they are at melee. All elves are good bard types. Halflings (including Strongheart) are okay for Bards, but they are more liable to get knockdown in the frontlines due to their size. The Halflings will be doing more backline work than frontline. Their cousin race, the Rock Gnomes are in the same boat as Halflings even though they get +2 to Constitution. The Deep Gnome has the worse attributes with -2 to Strength and -4 to Charisma. Half-Elves offer nothing and are in a category of their own. They only offer part of the same immunities as their elven parents and none of their human parent heritage such as extra feats or skill points. Steer clear of this race unless you're playing this race for roleplaying reasons. Half-Orc, Tiefling and Dwarves are races whom are least qualified to be a bard. Tielfling, Dwarf, and Half-Orcs get -2 to Charisma. Tieflings may get +2 Dexterity, +2 Intelligence, damage reduction to Fire, Ice and Electrical, a free Darkness spell, but it doesn't make up for the fact they get -2 towards Charisma. The Shield and the Gray Dwarves races get +2 to Constitution, but getting 9 points per level and +1 towards Fortitude save doesn't change their fact you have a low Charisma score. The Gold Dwarf is the only candidate worth being a Bard, but -2 to Dexterity makes it very difficult to be a true Bard as Dexterity is one of the bard's strengths. Half-Orcs are the worse out of the last three races mention as they get -2 towards both Intelligence and Charisma. The +2 is a waste since Strength that attribute is for melee purpose only. Like the Half-Elves, stay away from this race when you are considering making a bard. -------------------------------------------- F. Good Classes to take in consideration when multi-classing. Duelist: Add one If you reduce your Strength to 10, Intelligence to 14 and get one level of Duelist, you'll get an AC of 16 with both Dexterity and Intelligence bonus added. With +5 Robes, you'll gain +5 for 21, with tumble you'll gain 23, Dodge +1 for 24 and more with TWF Defense. You can go 5 more levels for Precision Strike. Rogue: 4 levels of Rogue will land you 2d6 sneak attack, Evasion and Uncanny Dodge. Arcane Archer: Good for both its saves and Fighter-Like BAB, even if you don't use a bow. Get 4 levels of Arcane Archer to get a 4th attack. Cleric: Cleric offers medium armor, if you are looking to get the Battlecaster feat. The cleric offers Healing Domain to make your healing spells better, Water for Evasion and Air for Uncanny Dodge. Only one level is recommended. Fighter or Blackguard: Blackguard offers Charisma saves, free medium armor feat for Battlecasters and Sneak Attack while the Fighter offers additional feats for feat combat. I recommended to level only four levels in either one of the classes. -------------------------------------------- G. FAQ 1. Is this build for the original Campaign? No, the build is for any server or campaign. I understand there are some people turned off by the items offered in campaign mode. Some players prefer low enchantment items while others like to indulge high enchantment items. Besides, the Original Campaign is a push over so offer advice on how to play a bard in that module is pointless. 2. I want to use Medium Armor with a pure class Bard. I wouldn't recommend it. Most Armor found in DnD and Neverwinter Night 2, will give you a total of 8 AC depending on Dexterity bonus. For example, if you are wearing a chainmail, which grants 4 AC to a character and you have a dexterity score of 18, you'll get +4 dexterity bonus for a total of 8. The difference between armors is, how much of a penalty you get for dexterity-based skills. 3. Is there any other way to build my bard? The feats will not be the same because attribute advantages and disadvantages as well as the number of feats and skills each race gets. A pure class bard Aasimar only get 7 feats where as human will get 8 feats and an extra skills point after level 1 so they will be slight difference in what the bard build will look like, but the overall goal is to be versatile. 4. There are other spells and feats you didn't mention here. Why? Those spells or feat I didn't mention, weren't worth mention because they either weren't versatile such bull's strength or the feats attempt to specialization the Bard such as power attack. For example, a Bard doesn't need knockdown because of his low Strength score nor does the Bard need Hold person since Hold person isn't as affective as Sleep, which gives you the ability to Coup De Grace your opponents. 5. I hear Bard suck as a class. Depend on what DnD game you've played in the pass. For example, Bards in the original Neverwinter Nights were horribly made as a class and were working with little. Even after epic levels, they weren't worth getting get more than 1 or 3 levels in. However, it's in my option that Obsidian, the crew behind Neverwinter Night 2, did a better job in making the Bard into a strategic class. A well placed spell can take out classes such as Fighters, Rogues, Rangers, Paladins have a tough times is when they are faced against constructs, undead and creature immunity to mind-saves. A well played Bard can "Whoa" their friends by showing them a display of their feats and spells. 6. I keep hearing fans say "You Spoony Bard" That's a quote made famous by Tellah the Sage from Final Fantasy II from for the SNES. (Actually, it was the fourth sequel to the Final Fantasy series in Japan because Final Fantasy 2 and 3 for the NES never came to America.) It was a mistranslation on Squaresoft, now known as SquareEnix and the word spoony is synonyms with "scoundrel." ***Spoiler Alert*** In the SNES game, Cecil, Rydia and Tellah will arrive at the footstep of a demolished Damacyn Castle after Goblez plunder their fire crystal and killing most of its residence. If you go to top floor in the game, Tellah will find find his daughter Anna lying on the ground mortally wounded and spots Edward (who is original Japanese name I believe is either Gilbert or Gilbart) and perceives him as his daughter killer. Right before fighting Edward, Tellah calls Edward a Spoony Bard. (Tellah also calls Edward Spoony Bard during the fight as well.) -------------------------------------------- H. Copyright and Permission All the material written here is copy of myself and will not be used without permission from me.