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coineineagh 7 years ago#1
I just noticed some improved class info on the following website:
It has been done for all classes, and a lot of the info appears to have been copy-pasted, along with the same brackets, slashes and terms I used, such as: "{basic, Baldur & Damasc}" and "Spellcraft I-IV 4/17/29/42 120/370/560/740 ".

I'm pretty sure that's in violation of my copyright, since the site clearly earns income with advertisement traffic. The info was probaly updated by a volunteer, and I don't want to make too much of a fuss over this. But, I must insist that they credit the source of their info, my Skill FAQ.

Despite all their web design skills, I think my Skill FAQ still offers a superior overview for gamers, since you can easily see what a class DOESN'T have access to, as well as what it does have. I'm just worried that people will think my FAQ was a blatant copy of *their* info, instead of the other way around.

Should I get the assistance of GameFAQs webmasters in this, or would it be better to contact that 'wikia' site directly with a proposal that they credit the source of their info on every class page? I'm inexperienced with online legalities and such negotiations... I'd rather see my contribution credited, than demand that all the added info go to waste. Even copying info requires effort, and impeding access to information sorta goes against my principles.
"Strategy requires patience. If you have none, use more Archers." - coineineagh
coineineagh 7 years ago#2
I copy-pasted a bit myself onto every class page:

I must insist that you credit the copyrighted source of your skill information as "Skill FAQ by coineineagh". If you do not comply with this request within a month from today, I will be forced to demand that the site's webmasters delete the info you included here. You may delete this message afterwards.
"Strategy requires patience. If you have none, use more Archers." - coineineagh
Devil_Killer_JC 7 years ago#3
Considering that wiki doesn't appear to have a forum, that's probably the best you can do other than talking to the site's webmasters directly.

It still sucks that whoever edited that wiki didn't give credit where credit is due.
PSN: Devil_Killer_JCS, Nintendo ID: Devil_JCS, 3DS FC: 4596-9592-6480 MH4U, MHG and MHW IGN: JC
terran3999999 7 years ago#4
Here we go again.

Sure, it has to be an absolute that they copied you and it couldn't just have been some random coincidence that they used the same format as you. While you're at it, try to sue them. From across the world that is.
Amarant>>sano83. Amarant can deal max damage, what can sano83 do? Number of people who agree: 1.
nAMEHless 7 years ago#5
I don't know If you have seen Coineineagh but you have been left a message. (Pasted below)

Although I think some of the terms you site as copied are a bit generic to be copied as the numbers and skill names are as they appear in-game.

My apologies if you feel slighted by this. Which parts would you like copyrighted and/or how would you like it acknowledged? It can be awkward to copyright pages, so would acknowledgements on the Home/Main page be suffficent? We do have a general one towards Gamefaqs but I can directly name you. The main issue is that this has become a one-man project in recent months so I don't have amazing resources and have to use what I can, although I understand that this in no way validates direct copying/plagerism. Balthierfan (talk) 17:39, June 12, 2014 (UTC)

As a side question. How much of the wording would need to be changed to avoid copyright issues? None of the 'Overviews' (which iswhat I'm assuming your taking issue to) are directly copied - most opinionated material and comparative comments were removed and balanced with own opinions
nAMEHless 7 years ago#6
(If you don't mind the double post - couldn't see a way to edit above)
I used to add stuff to the wiki before it 'died' so I sympathise with the admin who responded - Balthierfan - as he is making the wiki all by himself but it seems he think's its the overviews that are the issue...

Is anyone here a wiki editor? - I want to give a hand but I don't feel knowledgable enough to add much but you guys probably could contribute plenty...
coineineagh 7 years ago#7
Thanks for telling me about this. I finally found the location of that message.

My edit still isn't confirmed. Maybe because I'm located in China. Hope it will get through.
My reply:
"--- Thanks for your swift reply. I'm happy that my guide was so helpful for you to reference for skills, and you are most welcome to use the info. I also don't wish to detract from the effort you put into this; it's a lot more appealing than my Notepad text. Very well presented. However, considering that you used so much of my data, and that large parts of it were copied directly, I feel that a source link would be in order. It helps to make clear to people where the data originated from. Any mistakes I might have unwittingly made, you can simply defer complaints to the source. I could keep you informed of big mistake corrections, if you'd like.

I also believe that my simple plain text overview offers something that your wikia does not: an overview of skills that a class does NOT have access to. A link to my guide may prove helpful for readers, and would increase my guide's exposure. We both help each other out this way.

If you could copy the following hyperlink anywhere in the Overview section of your Class webpages, I'd be most obliged: Source: Skill FAQ"

terran3999999 posted...
Here we go again.

Sure, it has to be an absolute that they copied you and it couldn't just have been some random coincidence that they used the same format as you. While you're at it, try to sue them. From across the world that is.

Actually, making a DMCA request isn't all that hard. Webmasters usually take them *very* seriously. Fortunately, it isn't likely to come to that, now.
"Strategy requires patience. If you have none, use more Archers." - coineineagh
nAMEHless 7 years ago#8
wikis seem to be down at the moment but I've noticed that he has added you and a link to your skills faq to the Home page aknowlegements.
nAMEHless 7 years ago#9
I've looked into the wiki copyright rules, and they operate under 'fair use'. Italiced stuff is copied from legal docs.

'fair use is any copying of copyrighted material done for a limited and “transformative” purpose, such as to comment upon, criticize, or parody a copyrighted work. Such uses can be done without permission from the copyright owner.
In other words, fair use is a defense against a claim of copyright infringement. If your use qualifies as a fair use, then it would not be considered an illegal infringement. Like free speech, it is somewhat open to interpretation. Most fair use analysis falls into two categories: (1) commentary and criticism, or (2) parody.

In this case the wiki comes under 'commentary'. If you are commenting upon or critiquing a copyrighted work — for instance, writing a book review — fair use principles allow you to reproduce some of the work to achieve your purposes. Some examples of commentary and criticism include:
search engines, criticism, news reporting, research, teaching, library archiving and scholarship.

In this case if you could consider it used for research purposes.
In terms of research, all you could claim copyright for is the presentation style as the 'data' (in this case the skills, levels, costs, etc) could be gained from his/her own 'research' - playing the game and seeing values for themselves.
In theory all they have done is little difference to a university/research student using the tables and presentation styles of previous articles. Although he should cite you out courtesy, they don't have too...

tl:dr Because the 'data' could be gained by his/her own research (ie. playing the game) by using a similar style to you for presentation they are within 'fair use' grounds
coineineagh 7 years ago#10
I'm no copyright expert, and it may be true that there's a loophole that allows my work to be copied without citation, but the example you gave is not it. He doesn't comment, criticize or parody my work. He makes no mention of me or my work on the class pages at all. For all intents and purposes, the data is presented as his own research (or something included in the game that he owns and is free to copy), and that's what I objected to.

Well, my FAQ got an acknowledgement on the homepage, so I guess that's better than nothing. I'd have preferred the Class pages, where my work actually appears, but that is a lot of editing after all.

[p.s. there are a small number of minor, uncorrected number errors in my data, which he unwittingly incorporated into his own pages. i never corrected these mistakes, in the eventuality that some copycat might claim they got their numbers themselves. those errors are basically my data fingerprint and proof of ownership. fortunately, Balthierfan was candid about using my data. but it's clear evidence in case I had to make a DMCA claim. ;-) ]
"Strategy requires patience. If you have none, use more Archers." - coineineagh
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