The reason this wasn't part of the 'Summer of Arcade' promotion...
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I basically popped in here to say Trisha_Goddard has no idea what he/she is talking about.
I've won over $2000 participating in tournaments for various competitive games. At this point, any sort of button pressing is of trivial consequence. This game is not for the faint of heart- it's the brainchild of a former fighting game developer. It is understandable that the game will come packed with a high skill requirement.
Trisha_Goddard states: "I certainly didn't die during the demo." However, this is not the focus of the game. It is primarily a competitive game. I'd like to see how well Trisha_Goddard fares online vs others.
You don't see people complaining about Guitar Hero's guitar controls just they've never played guitar before- instead, they practice. Likewise, you shouldn't complain about a competitive game's controls if you've never experienced its top-tier gameplay. It may be frustrating that you can't change the controls. However, there are people who will adapt and utilize them to their fullest. The developers certainly aren't scrubs at their own game- and they would have logically chosen the control set that would further the most competition.
If I came accross as arrogant during this post, good. This was my intent. Trisha_Goddard complaining about Shred Nebula is much like a senior citizen driving in the fast lane- They complain that everyone else drives too fast, but they don't realize that they're the ones driving slow.
P.S. Good job Crunchtime - from a fellow game programmer. Unfortunately I haven't had much time to play SN because, well, we're under "crunch time" for our project. :)
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
For the record, I really like control options and sometimes very experienced designers make tough decisions that piss people off. For example, not giving the simple option to invert your camera control (up/down or left/right) on 3rd person adventure games like Zelda Wind Waker, Jax and Daxter, etc was really annoying to me. So much, that for a while, I let myself miss out on those amazing games because I "struggled" with the camera control. Now I knew how easy it was for those big designers to simply put a check box in to flip the damn camera and I made sure that option was put into every Slayer Engine game we did. But I have no idea what their reasoning is for that and it is not my place even as a pro to second guess them- it was their call.
For Shred, I agree that more button mapping options on our game would have been better but there are internal reasons why we did not give more and it was not out of arrogance or disregard for players. Right Trigger for Thrust as an alternate I will admit would have been at a minimum worth it to make it better for everyone (and I am thinking about how to make that work within update restrictions for down the road (more to it then the1 line of code it would take under the hood).
But the way the ship aims is totally a needed feature and the discrete left/right is not an option, nor would it make this a better game, had it that way and it was slow and felt like crap on a pad (especially the left analog stick) vs. 2 buttons on an arcade control panel.
Think of this as a free-roaming combat space shooter, where you need that level of control, speed and response- a different beast where AI fights you and the patterns organic, they hunt you and the scoring system is based on more then knowing some fixed pattern.
All I can say is that these choices (right thrust aside) are solid and we are moving forward with the mega "shred" tournament planning for 2009 ($50k being raised for top places covering all 3 modes) where this control will empower the winning players to do the amazing feats needed to take home the cash.
To anyone else excited about the prospect of playing competitively in a new option like this game, I will be posting videos of raw online ranked play within 2 weeks to start showing such examples of real players kicking ass with this game.
Thanks for the support and even the criticism, we listen and actually do things about it (when it is reasonable).
FYI, my deleted post was a duplicate of the one just above this. DOH! And I do not mind explaining reasons to a point; because I am also now an educator and right or wrong (based on subjective view) at least sharing my process might help someone else down the road.
Phunk, Guitar Hero's controls are intuitive. That's the difference.
I don't think I've seen a dev team so defensive. Even Minter wasn't this bad after Space Giraffe.
They don't really strike me as being defensive.
Now, Dyack... THAT'S a dev being defensive.
I'm speaking out of turn here, but the SN devs just seem to want to address concerns.
There's a difference between being sorry "you don't like (our) game" and sorry "you're not cool enough to 'get' (our) game".
"Thanks for the support and even the criticism, we listen and actually do things about it (when it is reasonable)."
'when it is reasonable' didn't need to be said unless it was a dig at the criticism.
look its pretty simple and its been re-hashed a few times now
it *isn't* a spiritual successor to SC, to Armada, it proved to be different
knee-jerk reaction is 'wtf is up with the controls??'
any real time with even the trial though and you notice drifting/rotating won't cut the mustard
it's an action game, combos, kill-or-be-blown up, it's not any kind of lazy stroll through space
could there be more options? sure.
do you seem to get a lot for 800 pts tho? yes.
it's probably a bit catch-22, they got SC/Armada fans in the door - I'm one of them
but it *is* a different type of game, which has its own merits and fun - it's just not SC/Armada
again almost more of a space brawler - take care of business NOW, not on 'next pass'
I didn't read it as defensive but explanatory, and hey, they put a lot of time/effort/money into it
maybe more of a 'what it is and is not' post initially would have helped
either way I think its one of the better offerings in the XBLA line-up
This GF board is our official community link on our website and GF for me personally has been a place where I talk to players of current and previous games and get cool ideas and insight into what works, what could be better, etc.
So to anyone with the desire to give direct suggestions to us on what would make the game better, this board is the right place to do it. We are working on things in the background with Shred and the players will have a huge role in the design of what we are working on. Which could include control tweaks that will can be done within the restrictions of a Title Update (down the road).
For example button mapping- on this and other boards, people really want Right Trigger for thrust. Check. Rotation old-school (Stick/Pad Left/Right), sorry, we are not going to do that one as explained above, it does not in the long-run work at the pace of this game.
But thanks for checking out the game even though you apparently did not get it.
I'm gonna have to go with defensive on that one.
I find television very educating. Every time somebody turns on the set, I go into the other room and read a book.
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