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Curious why people always quote G2G as input lag.

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  3. Curious why people always quote G2G as input lag.

User Info: ElDudorino

ElDudorino
5 months ago#21
When it comes down to it, the official specs for displays are mostly BS. Nobody follows any standard for measuring response time and the same is true of dynamic contrast ratio, with the effect that companies just kept making up bigger numbers for their displays. This one's 1000:1, this one's a million to one, and then they jumped the shark at some point a handful of years ago and started advertising the dynamic contrast ratio as infinity to one. Then you have refresh rate that means a different thing for LCDs than it did for CRTs, and a different thing for TVs than it does for monitors, so that only a tiny minority of people actually know what they're talking about when it comes to them. Even resolution is sometimes tricky since 720p was never standardized and there are at least two "4K" resolutions as well.

I don't even look at the advertised specs for a display I'm considering purchasing. Instead, I look for professional reviewers who have actually run tests that measure the real performance and compare their findings where possible. That's the only way you can actually get valid information.

User Info: ClunkerSlim

ClunkerSlim
5 months ago#22
MASKOAAA posted...
I always see them quote the 1ms.......or 5ms.....people do know thats not input lag right?

https://displaylag.com/display-database/

It may be because the numbers are somewhat related in that a cheap monitor with long GTG times will probably be slow with heavy input lag too. It’s probably also because no one really measures input lag and it’s not included in any industry spec sheets. Even the websites that track it only have done a small selection of monitors.
https://twitter.com/ClunkerSlim

User Info: ElDudorino

ElDudorino
5 months ago#23
ClunkerSlim posted...
MASKOAAA posted...
I always see them quote the 1ms.......or 5ms.....people do know thats not input lag right?

https://displaylag.com/display-database/

It may be because the numbers are somewhat related in that a cheap monitor with long GTG times will probably be slow with heavy input lag too. It’s probably also because no one really measures input lag and it’s not included in any industry spec sheets. Even the websites that track it only have done a small selection of monitors.

GTG is not standardized, so 1ms could be *faster* than 5ms depending on the monitor. "Long GTG times" is a phrase that unfortunately doesn't really have any meaning.

User Info: ClunkerSlim

ClunkerSlim
5 months ago#24
ElDudorino posted...
ClunkerSlim posted...
MASKOAAA posted...
I always see them quote the 1ms.......or 5ms.....people do know thats not input lag right?

https://displaylag.com/display-database/

It may be because the numbers are somewhat related in that a cheap monitor with long GTG times will probably be slow with heavy input lag too. It’s probably also because no one really measures input lag and it’s not included in any industry spec sheets. Even the websites that track it only have done a small selection of monitors.

GTG is not standardized, so 1ms could be *faster* than 5ms depending on the monitor. "Long GTG times" is a phrase that unfortunately doesn't really have any meaning.

I think that’s an over exaggeration. I think the inconsistency comes from the fact that not all response times are measured grey to grey and response times are probably grouped into categories (1ish, 5ish). But I wouldn’t throw those specs out with the trash and say they’re meaningless. Chances are your TN panel IS around 1ms and your IPS panel IS around 5ms.
https://twitter.com/ClunkerSlim

User Info: ClunkerSlim

ClunkerSlim
5 months ago#25
ElDudorino posted...
Even resolution is sometimes tricky since 720p was never standardized and

Oh yeah, when I was searching for monitors last year I was combing through Amazon reviews and read this interesting review by someone who claimed to work in the industry. Apparently this one monitor claimed to be 1440p (was really cheap for 1440p) and this guy said that LG, Samsung, or somebody was making panels that were labeled as 1440p but they really weren’t. The pixels were arranged somehow to sort of “fake” a 1440p resolution. I don’t know. Monitor shopping is the worst.
https://twitter.com/ClunkerSlim

User Info: ElDudorino

ElDudorino
5 months ago#26
I'm saying the issue is that not all grays are created equal. If Black to White measurements were used, we could assume Black to be 000000 and White to be FFFFFF, but when they say "Gray to Gray" you could have Dell going from 222222 to DDDDDD and you could have Samsung going from 333333 to CCCCCC and Samsung's times would look faster, but then the next year Dell could decide they're tired of being screwed over and they could measure 444444 to BBBBBB and then THEIR times would look faster.

I've seen lots of places saying that there is no standardization when it comes to response time measurement and that different companies use different measurements, but I've never seen any kind of source say that the actual grays used in "GTG" are equal across tests. If some companies are using different grays from other companies or using different grays at different times or even for different models at the same time, they technically wouldn't be committing any crime and so why wouldn't they abuse that spec the way we've seen Contrast Ratio abused?

User Info: zhenghan

zhenghan
5 months ago#27
And then there is the fact that the response time could be 5ms on one part of the screen, but 15ms on another part. Are they going to quote the lowest, the highest, or the average? My money's on lowest xD just because it looks that much better on the box.
"dude i am like a 10 th grader,i am not smart i am not smart okay.i know basic english not level 100 english lol" -stephanielish

User Info: ElDudorino

ElDudorino
5 months ago#28
zhenghan posted...
And then there is the fact that the response time could be 5ms on one part of the screen, but 15ms on another part. Are they going to quote the lowest, the highest, or the average? My money's on lowest xD just because it looks that much better on the box.

Is it actually different at different parts of the screen? If so then yeah for sure they would want to quote the fastest part.

The funny thing though is that I don't even think it's a real battle. "1ms", "5ms", "8ms", at the end of the day is anybody even really noticing ghosting on any of these displays? The last time I was like damn look out for that ghosting, I was looking at a PSP display.

User Info: Kokuei05

Kokuei05
5 months ago#29
G2G and contrast on monitors are complete bulls*** because there isn't a standard every companies uses and they all use arbitary loopholes to make their product more appealing than it actually is.

I'll use my monitor as an example. NEC EA232WMI, if you google it, you'll see the G2G as 14ms. At first glance, you'll be "WTF".

Then you look at a review of it, http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/nec_ea232wmi.htm#input_lag, and see it has an incredibly low 8.1ms input lag compared to CRT.
i7-6700K | Team Vulcan 16GB 3000Mhz | MSI z170a SLI PLUS | EVGA 650W G2 | Zotac 8GB GTX 1080 Mini | EA232WMI
e7470 | i5-6300U | 8GB DDR4 || Surface Pro 2 i5.

User Info: zhenghan

zhenghan
5 months ago#30
Kokuei05 posted...
G2G and contrast on monitors are complete bulls*** because there isn't a standard every companies uses and they all use arbitary loopholes to make their product more appealing than it actually is.

I'll use my monitor as an example. NEC EA232WMI, if you google it, you'll see the G2G as 14ms. At first glance, you'll be "WTF".

Then you look at a review of it, http://www.tftcentral.co.uk/reviews/nec_ea232wmi.htm#input_lag, and see it has an incredibly low 8.1ms input lag compared to CRT.

that's input lag though, not even response time.
"dude i am like a 10 th grader,i am not smart i am not smart okay.i know basic english not level 100 english lol" -stephanielish
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