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  3. On learning Counter

User Info: loseless

loseless
2 months ago#1
The illusive move, Counter, can be a pain to learn. After some research and a few hours of frustration, here's some tips:

ShimaUnimon has this move, but not all of them. After reducing the ShimaUnimon population by a few hundred, mostly on the first screen of Gear Savannah (with the LED board with directions to the Factorial Town), I noticed that they had Muscle Charge or Warcry (can't tell which one), Megalo Spark and Dynamite Kick. No room left for Counter. So I tried other ShimaUnimon.

On the screen just north of this one, I found my prey. This little horsie did not use Megalo Spark. I also confirmed by equipping Sonic Jab on my MetalMamemon and giving it a few punches. He managed to counter one or two, i.e. it headbutted me when I tried to attack it, which meant Counter activated, as Dynamite Kick is, well, a back kick.

I fought all the other ShimaUnimon in Gear Savannah and none of them had Counter, including the one by the Trash Mountain entrance, that was pointed by some users as having the move equipped. So, unless their moves change depending on the time of day, I reckon the one I mention is the only one carrying the move (which explains the issues with learning it).

As for learning the move, I believe you can learn the move just by being equipped on the enemy digimon. I learned a lot of moves over the years without them ever being used. And sometimes I killed the enemy digimon during his first move and I learned a move that he was not using. But I'm not holding my breath on this one.

You should also have a digimon with Battle as its first element. Otherwise it might take too long or be outright impossible if it it's third type.

Cheers!

User Info: SydMontague

SydMontague
2 months ago#2
NPC Digimon can have up to 4 moves equipped, since they often lack a finisher. Also, all 7 ShimaUnimon have the same set of moves equipped.

In order to learn a move it has to be used in battle, with "used" being defined by the MP cost being deducted (i.e. started casting). Getting hit or the number of times a move gets used doesn't matter. However, it might be possible that special rules apply to Counter specifically, I haven't looked that up yet.
"I'm a god because I take upon myself the burden of creation." - from Alexandra's Choice, Galatea (The Talos Principle)

User Info: loseless

loseless
2 months ago#3
Thanks for the input. Are you quite sure all ShimaUnimon have the same moveset? I spent a few hours testing this. There's a lot of misinformation about this game and most people have impressions or claims and cling to them without putting them to test. I recognized that I could be wrong about the move having to be used to be learned (although I have evidence otherwise), but I spent several hours fighting the damn horses before I reached my conclusions.

I wish people had been able to crack the game and present unequivocal data on these and many other questions, but it seems trial and error and anecdotal evidence is the best we have.

User Info: SydMontague

SydMontague
2 months ago#4
I'm one of the people who cracked the game. ;)

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/19E7zgE2JJN4LQnlv9TNzenTaeld5OcRzC99EkiM80Cw/edit#gid=1941316484

"I'm a god because I take upon myself the burden of creation." - from Alexandra's Choice, Galatea (The Talos Principle)

User Info: loseless

loseless
2 months ago#5
Great! Hadn't found that information anywhere.

Why isn't more of this data around? Half the docs on this game are incomplete or have major errors. Even the sticky here has glaring errors. Has no one bothered to assemble the information? Or GameFAQs just doesn't allow for new docs on this game? Because there are enough players are to warrant it and more than wrong information to justify such a thing.

User Info: SydMontague

SydMontague
2 months ago#6
I linked all my stuff in my evolution guide, but GameFAQs really isn't a great platform.

Creating that one has been a pain in the ass due to them not supporting exporting/importing guides into a sane format that can be used for maintenance, with their editor being not up to the task either. Especially working with tables is... difficult.

They also sometimes reject guides is there are "enough" other guides for the subject, although you can explain the differences to them. You can also report guides for containing misinformation, potentially leading to their removal.

The sticky thread is another thing, though. I reported that one a few times already without success.

Basically, GameFAQs is a meme.
"I'm a god because I take upon myself the burden of creation." - from Alexandra's Choice, Galatea (The Talos Principle)

User Info: loseless

loseless
2 months ago#7
Crap. I've been working of a guide for Divinity Original Sin EE for a year now. It'll end up with 100k words, which could warrant a new religion or something. Never tried the HTML option, but I'm considering it. It's that or the dumb plain text with the absurd formatting guidelines, as if this was the early 90s and everyone was using DOS and browsers couldn't handle cutting edge 1980s text software. For f sake, command lines are more flexible than GameFAQs documents...

I've been on GameFAQs for 15, 16 years, give or take. The issue with a site so big is that it becomes unmeneageble. Even if each title has its own mods, many guides are incomplete and mods tend to forget they exist. I see no reason why games with several good walk-throughs should have unfinished walk-throughs available, if the creators haven't bothered to update them in over two decades. The site policy also seems to be "screw it, we don't care" and never bother to clean or promote corrections to any game.

The current remasters/port frenzy also showed how obtuse this site can be, as some games have a dozen or so boards, one for each platform, with three or four threads in each of them, instead of having a shared board. Outside of controls and some technical aspects related to the platform, the game is the same. Having different boards seems like something someone decided without ever using the site, as it literally benefits nobody.

I'll try to contact a mod about the sticky, but I expect their answer to be: incomplete information and some errors are better than nothing, which is a valid argument. If there was a better thread it would be easier.
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