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User Info: MakotoYuri

MakotoYuri
3 months ago#51
giving Haru Riot Gun is probably overkill, it´s the strongest non-unique skill in the game, she would just straight up out damage everyone else aside for the MC.
If you obey Lucifer and are 100% proud of it, copy this and make it your signature! RPGs Beaten: 666

User Info: GammaDelta

GammaDelta
3 months ago#52
MakotoYuri posted...
giving Haru Riot Gun is probably overkill, it´s the strongest non-unique skill in the game, she would just straight up out damage everyone else aside for the MC.

On second thought, I think you're right. With Debilitate, Snipe and Cripple, Haru could do just fine with Triple Down and One-Shot Kill. I really want her to be more of use ; she's so close to being very good in P5 but falls a bit short compared to the Top 3 (Ryuji, Ann and Makoto), imo.

User Info: Cogito

Cogito
3 months ago#53
^make baton pass a default mechanic so she'll be useful for her dungeon.
swap fast heal for heat riser as an innate skill so she gets a powerful ST triple buff before others learn ma-buffs.
swap the orginal HT for debilitate to learn at 75 so she gets an endgame support.
no sig. change to her offense skillset unless you want her to inflict ailment.
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User Info: MakotoYuri

MakotoYuri
3 months ago#54
GammaDelta posted...
MakotoYuri posted...
giving Haru Riot Gun is probably overkill, it´s the strongest non-unique skill in the game, she would just straight up out damage everyone else aside for the MC.

On second thought, I think you're right. With Debilitate, Snipe and Cripple, Haru could do just fine with Triple Down and One-Shot Kill. I really want her to be more of use ; she's so close to being very good in P5 but falls a bit short compared to the Top 3 (Ryuji, Ann and Makoto), imo.

the problem is that she is already pretty much as good as Ann, aside from her coming way to late, buffing her in anyway makes Ann obsolete.
If you obey Lucifer and are 100% proud of it, copy this and make it your signature! RPGs Beaten: 666

User Info: GammaDelta

GammaDelta
2 months ago#55
MakotoYuri posted...
GammaDelta posted...
MakotoYuri posted...
giving Haru Riot Gun is probably overkill, it´s the strongest non-unique skill in the game, she would just straight up out damage everyone else aside for the MC.

On second thought, I think you're right. With Debilitate, Snipe and Cripple, Haru could do just fine with Triple Down and One-Shot Kill. I really want her to be more of use ; she's so close to being very good in P5 but falls a bit short compared to the Top 3 (Ryuji, Ann and Makoto), imo.

the problem is that she is already pretty much as good as Ann, aside from her coming way to late, buffing her in anyway makes Ann obsolete.

I dunno. Firstly, in terms of stats at the same level, Ann's Luck is slightly better, and her Magic tends to outdo Haru's Strength.

When Haru becomes a party member, her Psy skills are useful in the 5th Palace, but she doesn't have what I'd call a strong start. If the MC has got Mapsio and an SP Adhesive, you can afford not to use Haru and keep Ann in your party. Amrita Drop isn't as valuable as Makoto's Energy Shower or Morgana's Me Patra, being single-target only. Her Magic damage output is quite low, and she tends to miss Triple Down. Her barrier skills are also not necessary at all. Plus, she doesn't get any automatic boosting skills until lvl 42 for Psy Boost, and lvl 54 for Snipe.

The only point in the game where I'd say Haru's slightly better than Ann is around lvl 60. At that point, she got Psiodyne, Snipe, One-Shot Kill and Amrita Shower one after another. These are all great skills, which make Haru a good pick for your party ; until Ann gets Concentrate to boost her Fire skills even more at lvl 63. Haru, on the other hand, needs to wait till lvl 68 for her Gun skills to become super strong (thanks to Cripple) ; and that's the exact same level at which Ann learns Fire Amp, giving her the definitive edge for the rest of the game, imo. Blazing Hell is also quite nice.

That's why I believe giving Haru Debilitate over Heat Riser and allowing her to use Baton Pass as early as the 5th Palace would make her better, and a pick as strong as Ann, but not stronger. Other buffs to her at the start would also be nice (like giving her Amrita Shower from the get-go or something).

User Info: MakotoYuri

MakotoYuri
2 months ago#56
i´m more talking about end game when they have their full skill set, though Haru is quite strong with Triple Down.
GammaDelta posted...
The only point in the game where I'd say Haru's slightly better than Ann is around lvl 60. At that point, she got Psiodyne, Snipe, One-Shot Kill and Amrita Shower one after another. These are all great skills, which make Haru a good pick for your party ; until Ann gets Concentrate to boost her Fire skills even more at lvl 63. Haru, on the other hand, needs to wait till lvl 68 for her Gun skills to become super strong (thanks to Cripple) ; and that's the exact same level at which Ann learns Fire Amp, giving her the definitive edge for the rest of the game, imo. Blazing Hell is also quite nice.


actually the difference between a concentrated Blazing Hell and casteing Triple Down twice is a forgettable, 20-50 points in damage in Anns favor.
the argument here is rather if you want Ann for Tarunda or Haru for ailment heal, Haru also is less squishy, uses HP instead of SP for attacks and covers an element more then Ann.
If you obey Lucifer and are 100% proud of it, copy this and make it your signature! RPGs Beaten: 666

User Info: GammaDelta

GammaDelta
2 months ago#57
@MakotoYuri Could you give the formula to calculate damage, please ? I don't wanna keep saying incorrect information about the game.

My biggest gripe with Triple Down is how unlucky I am when using it. One time, I missed Triple Down twice in a row against a Mementos boss. Of course, they didn't resist or evade Gun, and everyone was at +0 Hit/Evasion. This sorta makes me biased, even though I'm not trying to be.

About Blazing Hell, I mentioned in one of my earlier posts that I wanted to increase its power and decrease the SP cost, maybe from 54 to around 45 (same for Atomic Flare and the other Severe elemental skills). This would buff Ann's damage, I think, while allowing her to save some SP every time. It would be the only buff I'd give to Ann, as I think she's great, while leaving her with a downside : not being able to cause damage with anything other than Fire. That way, Ann would still be a good contender for a place in the party at every stage of the game.

Haru would get Debilitate earlier in the late game (lvl 66?), Baton Pass in late September, and Amrita Shower pretty early on for her to be a stronger option in the 5th and 6th Palace. Her state in the late game (7th and 8th Palaces) is pretty good, even if she's kind of outshone by Ann right now, but with Debilitate, I believe she'd be on par with her.
Haru would have amazing Gun damage, nice Psy damage and a great debuff, while Ann would have insane Fire damage, good debuffs and access to ailments (which would finally be usable on bosses if all the changes I stated could come true).

Of course, a lot of this is either hypothetical or my opinion. But I think that with these changes, you could choose to use Ann or Haru in battle and still profit equally from both of their kits. I hope.

User Info: GammaDelta

GammaDelta
2 months ago#58
As for Ann being frailer than Haru... I need to check how big of a difference it is. I'd argue that Haru and Ann have got a similar Endurance stat, and that Haru's reliance on Gun damage, which drains her HP, can make her sometimes more frail than Ann. But I'm not sure.
Besides, I think consuming a lot of SP isn't too much of a problem as soon as you can ask Kawakami to make coffee/curry for you every night, and becomes even less of a problem thanks to Haru's veggies.

User Info: MakotoYuri

MakotoYuri
2 months ago#59
@GammaDelta i don´t have a formula, i tested it.
also you got unlucky, as i never seen Triple Down miss.

Haru got 20points more HP, 4 point in Endurance more and 3 points in Agility more, a not so common weakness and climate decorum, arguably there is also the -karns but nobody uses them anyway.
granted Ann can cast Tarunda, but that takes a turn for a buff that only Ann needs to survive the other PT survive without problem with Makotos Rakukaja.
which means Haru wins the DPS race.

her only big downside is that she comes so late and as i said any buff would make Ann obsolete, atleast in endgame, i mean they could do it then we would have a Morgana/Makoto situation.

a buff to magic could help, as they are already to weak and to costdy, though i wonder if people would care about Ann if Haru came with Debilitate or Marakunda, a dmg boost for eyeryone seems more valuable.
If you obey Lucifer and are 100% proud of it, copy this and make it your signature! RPGs Beaten: 666

User Info: GammaDelta

GammaDelta
2 months ago#60
MakotoYuri posted...
@GammaDelta i don´t have a formula, i tested it.
also you got unlucky, as i never seen Triple Down miss.

Haru got 20points more HP, 4 point in Endurance more and 3 points in Agility more, a not so common weakness and climate decorum, arguably there is also the -karns but nobody uses them anyway.
granted Ann can cast Tarunda, but that takes a turn for a buff that only Ann needs to survive the other PT survive without problem with Makotos Rakukaja.
which means Haru wins the DPS race.

her only big downside is that she comes so late and as i said any buff would make Ann obsolete, atleast in endgame, i mean they could do it then we would have a Morgana/Makoto situation.

a buff to magic could help, as they are already to weak and to costdy, though i wonder if people would care about Ann if Haru came with Debilitate or Marakunda, a dmg boost for eyeryone seems more valuable.

I see. I'm starting to think more and more that Debilitate would be overkill on Haru. But I wouldn't mind some buffs for her when she joins the party (i. e. Baton Pass and Amrita Shower early on). For Ann, the buffs to the Severe elemental skills (Blazing Hell, Atomic Flare...) many have spoken about would also be nice.
I've never really used of Climate Decorum. It looks very useful, but I'd need to organize my visits in Palaces and Mementos according to the weather to make full use of it until December.
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