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coconutarmy1 1 month ago#1
Cyberpunk 2077 introduces a lot of really cool stuff. And also, a lot of really impractically dumb stuff that no rational person would buy over what we currently have. Here are my personal choices for "worst "advancement" in Night City".

Powered mirrors
This is a mirror that only reflects if you turn it on. The surface is still glass, it's just transparent glass. We've had perfectly functional mirrors that don't require power since 1835, and they don't turn off if the electricity goes out, or need time to boot up, or have the potential to be hacked into so that someone can spy on your room. There are no necessary advancements for mirrors, the ones available in 2021 do exactly what they're supposed to perfectly, 24/7.

My electronic limbs are connected to wifi
Why on earth does this help? These things are so easy to hack into and mess with that most groups have a guy that can do it in 20 seconds or less. Modern electric prosthetics are not connected to wifi, they're pre-programmed to function. This means that you can go on a hike without your arm shutting down, and nobody can access your arm's command center and make it do weird stuff. Some common, low level hacks in Cyberpunk include making audio implants cause temporary deafness, making things overheat and cause horrible bodily damage, or making them explode into electric shocks that kills the owner of said implants instantly. This is not a good look for any company.

AI with emotions
This is exactly what you don't want, and while I think the Cyberpunk version is less ridiculous than the Fallout 4 iteration, if you give a robot human emotions and make it do a menial task, it will hate that menial task as much as a human would. If you don't bother to program emotions and instead just give it the necessary code to complete the task the same way every time (way easier to do), that's all it will ever do. The task. Perfectly. In the exact same way every single time. With no emotions one way or the other, just cold, calculating precision. This is absolutely what you want for a taxi robot, or a restaurant, or any number of other things.

Full body combat replacements
Adam Smasher is really strong. You know what he's not good at? Literally anything else. Imagine this guy trying to use a pencil, or play an instrument, or sleep comfortably. This is a case of crippling overspecialization. He was designed to be good at fighting, and he is really good at fighting. What he's not good at is comfortably picking up a glass and raising it to his mouth without fear of shattering it in his robot body's death grip. Not worth the cost.
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Kazli 1 month ago#2
The mirror thing sounds like it's a technical limitation based on how mirrors work in video games. Everything else is just trying to illustrate the horrors or potential missteps of future transhumanism, same concepts explored in 'Blade Runner' or 'Ghost in the Shell' really.
coconutarmy1 1 month ago#3
Kazli posted...
The mirror thing sounds like it's a technical limitation based on how mirrors work in video games. Everything else is just trying to illustrate the horrors or potential missteps of future transhumanism, same concepts explored in 'Blade Runner' or 'Ghost in the Shell' really.
It's always the same concept. "What happens if we make AI way too smart for the menial jobs we have it perform?" Like... why? Why would anyone expend that much effort to create something that's less efficient and more prone to violent revolution than just a normal robot? Blade Runner's androids are miners- and like... if we can make perfectly functional artificial humans, couldn't we make robots designed for that specific task? And you can't tell me that Ghost in the Shell needed an additional human brain when literally we have drones that do that same thing but better.

It's a poorly thought out singular flaw that is such a crutch of science fiction, and it's just straight up not a realistic problem. When faced with a cheap, effective solution or an expensive solution that actually lowers productivity, nobody would do the secondary option. Realistic human like AI has its functions- Detroit Become Human actually managed to come up with two. There are prostitute robots (not ideal but it does require a human analogue) and a caretaker robot (which is absolutely ideal. They can be around 24/7 when normal people can't, and if they're able to function and converse like normal people, they're just better hospice workers). The second one especially has the bonus of being a generally fulfilling job that a human like AI would understand the value of, and also understand why they're the only one who can do it.
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Big_Boar 1 month ago#4
Kazli posted...
The mirror thing sounds like it's a technical limitation based on how mirrors work in video games. Everything else is just trying to illustrate the horrors or potential missteps of future transhumanism, same concepts explored in 'Blade Runner' or 'Ghost in the Shell' really.

Same concepts, but not explored nearly enough or done even half as well as Blade Runner and Ghost in the Shell.

One of the many surprising disappointments with this game, is that it fails quite badly at the cyberpunk atmosphere in terms of themes, concepts and overall setting. For me, it’s not very ‘cyberpunk’ at all. This is made worse by the terrible but likely rushed design decision to opt for a very rigid protagonist. More themes and concepts could have been more easily introduced and explored had there been the option of playing as a character of our own choosing, rather than just V.
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Kazli 1 month ago#5
Big_Boar posted...
Same concepts, but not explored nearly enough or done even half as well as Blade Runner and Ghost in the Shell.

One of the many surprising disappointments with this game, is that it fails quite badly at the cyberpunk atmosphere in terms of themes, concepts and overall setting. For me, it’s not very ‘cyberpunk’ at all. This is made worse by the terrible but likely rushed design decision to opt for a very rigid protagonist. More themes and concepts could have been more easily introduced and explored had there been the option of playing as a character of our own choosing, rather than just V.

Metal body parts and neon lights is apparently all the Cyberpunk that this needed to be for some people.
Kazli 1 month ago#6
coconutarmy1 posted...
It's always the same concept. "What happens if we make AI way too smart for the menial jobs we have it perform?" Like... why? Why would anyone expend that much effort to create something that's less efficient and more prone to violent revolution than just a normal robot? Blade Runner's androids are miners- and like... if we can make perfectly functional artificial humans, couldn't we make robots designed for that specific task? And you can't tell me that Ghost in the Shell needed an additional human brain when literally we have drones that do that same thing but better.

It's a poorly thought out singular flaw that is such a crutch of science fiction, and it's just straight up not a realistic problem. When faced with a cheap, effective solution or an expensive solution that actually lowers productivity, nobody would do the secondary option. Realistic human like AI has its functions- Detroit Become Human actually managed to come up with two. There are prostitute robots (not ideal but it does require a human analogue) and a caretaker robot (which is absolutely ideal. They can be around 24/7 when normal people can't, and if they're able to function and converse like normal people, they're just better hospice workers). The second one especially has the bonus of being a generally fulfilling job that a human like AI would understand the value of, and also understand why they're the only one who can do it.

Solid points.

I think sometimes the motivation behind the decision to build overly complex machines with advanced A.I just to have them perform basic tasks or tasks that are performed well enough by simpler modern-day machines is just "can we build this?"
They never stop to ask "should we build this?" Or "do we even need this?"

Though ultimately it's just done in fiction for the purpose of telling a story about a hypothetical future where people have too much technology and not enough sense.

I do like 'Detroit Become Human', much more than Cyberpunk 2077, and of the David Cage games it would be my favorite.
coconutarmy1 1 month ago#7
Kazli posted...
Solid points.

I think sometimes the motivation behind the decision to build overly complex machines with advanced A.I just to have them perform basic tasks or tasks that are performed well enough by simpler modern-day machines is just "can we build this?"
They never stop to ask "should we build this?" Or "do we even need this?"

Though ultimately it's just done in fiction for the purpose of telling a story about a hypothetical future where people have too much technology and not enough sense.

I do like 'Detroit Become Human', much more than Cyberpunk 2077, and of the David Cage games it would be my favorite.
There's the other crutch of Science Fiction! "We never thought if we "should", we only thought if we "could". It's an excuse to avoid giving the villains of the story any real motivation or drive. "They just did it because they could" is the weakest motivation ever, and nobody actually does that. America didn't go to the moon just because they could, they did it because the Russians could and they needed to do it first because the Cold War was a battle of fragile egos. No one but science fiction writers and horror writers think they can get away with that bullcrap, and some shows that do (Sword Art Online for instance) get absolutely blasted for it. This isn't how human motivation works. You can't possibly do something just because it's feasible to do, you need a motivation, and that motivation can be curiosity, but curiosity doesn't push you to 80 hour workweeks and tremendous useless advances in technology. Necessity does.
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In the case of Adam smasher, it's lore related. He's just that much of a freak. He has a rival solo that he's trying to surpass to be the best which is what led him to do what he did to himself. He has no purpose in life other than surpassing his rival and killing, that's it. Now in the case of Lizzy wizzy, I'd agree with you. Going full chrome would be weird and limiting.
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Kazli 1 month ago#9
coconutarmy1 posted...
There's the other crutch of Science Fiction! "We never thought if we "should", we only thought if we "could". It's an excuse to avoid giving the villains of the story any real motivation or drive. "They just did it because they could" is the weakest motivation ever, and nobody actually does that. America didn't go to the moon just because they could, they did it because the Russians could and they needed to do it first because the Cold War was a battle of fragile egos. No one but science fiction writers and horror writers think they can get away with that bullcrap, and some shows that do (Sword Art Online for instance) get absolutely blasted for it. This isn't how human motivation works. You can't possibly do something just because it's feasible to do, you need a motivation, and that motivation can be curiosity, but curiosity doesn't push you to 80 hour workweeks and tremendous useless advances in technology. Necessity does.

Necessity is the mother of invention after all. Random jumps in technology with nothing to drive it is unrealistic and tropey. There are some works of fiction that avoid that problem, but they're almost all about fighting wars against aliens or giant monsters, thus the drive to advance technology is just to forge weapons to fight big monsters or defend against alien invasion.
coconutarmy1 1 month ago#10
Kazli posted...
Necessity is the mother of invention after all. Random jumps in technology with nothing to drive it is unrealistic and tropey. There are some works of fiction that avoid that problem, but they're almost all about fighting wars against aliens or giant monsters, thus the drive to advance technology is just to forge weapons to fight big monsters or defend against alien invasion.
I think the best way to get an alternative world is to provide alternative resources. Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles, for example, has dense cities built on the top of hills with a giant crystal. These keep deadly mist away but also change city structure.
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