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  3. What exactly are you supposed to do, etc.?

User Info: Solarys

Solarys
1 month ago#1
Is this game winnable in the first play-through? How many characters/lives do you get in total to beat the boss?

The game suggests that the more characters/lives you sacrifice, the stronger you become; and I assume that you lose if you either lose all your lives, or fail to kill the boss before it eats the entire map. So is it better to fight to the death the first time with each character to strengthen your final one as soon as possible, or use all 3 chances and do as much damage as you can on each life? Does the damage you do on your "expendable" lives even matter in the end? (Is this like Persona 3 where you can just do the entire tower on your last day?)

The premise of this game seems innovative and interesting, but also very confusing since it doesn't really tell you what to do...
"Teamwork is essential, it gives them other people to shoot at."
MSI Z170A-S02 || Xeon E-2126G 4.1~4.5 GHz || 16 GB DDR4 2666 MHz || Radeon RX 480

User Info: Solarys

Solarys
1 month ago#2
Well, to answer the first part of my own question - yes, it's definitely winnable, and I think I messed up...

I got Trillion down to its final form with only my second character by abusing Rage and the AOE damage "exploit" in Mystery Dungeon games (AOE damage on the same unit counts as multiple hits), and that seems to have locked me out of Mokujin fights for the rest of the game. Then again, I probably don't need AP anymore, since Final Strike appears to do fixed % damage, I should be able to win by "suicide bombing" alone.
"Teamwork is essential, it gives them other people to shoot at."
MSI Z170A-S02 || Xeon E-2126G 4.1~4.5 GHz || 16 GB DDR4 2666 MHz || Radeon RX 480

User Info: BBQ_Soda

BBQ_Soda
1 month ago#3
It's been a while since I played it, but IIRC, you have to go through all characters if you want to see all chapters and the true end. How many characters you get depends on some of your choices later in the game. You will by default get 6, with Fegor (sloth) being your last one, but you can get a few more if you made the correct choices.
If you kill Trillion early, then you will end the game early and skip all remaining chapters, so it's highly not recommended for your first run.

I wouldn't say you messed up, but if you are still early in the run, you can start over and keep Trillion on its 2nd form for as long as possible, just so you can still retreat or let it cross the line twice per character and fight Mokujin for free EXP.
It doesn't really matter, though, since I found its 3rd form to be the easiest, if you seal its main body (sealing is permanent). It can only be hit by each skill once, so you're better off spending all your EXP on stats and passives. You already have Aerial Pierce and Kangaroo for movement.

The must-have passives are Rage (L3), Aggressive (L3), Defensive (L1), and Solid Mind (L3). Also get Ace and Armor Strike if you have points to spare (learn some AOE skills for Armor Strike). Save-scum for Affection+, get Final Sprint only after it, and only if you have enough points to max it, otherwise it's more of a hindrance, since Rage builds up stats more quickly.
Stay in place when the battle starts, and let Trillion come to you. Keep its minions alive and get hit on purpose for Rage boost.
Once your Solid Mind hits 200% and all stats hit ~700, get rid of all your remaining AP ASAP by taking a hit from Trillion, and that should boost your Attack and Defense to 999.
If you don't have a Range Seal, only hit it with normal attacks from the front or side, as it will use a barrier if you hit it from the back. But if you do have a Range Seal, then learn Ambush and it will become a joke.

For "suicide bombing", get Attack to 999 and both Solid Mind and Swing Charge to 200% before dying. Final Strike uses your Attack stat and damage modifiers at the time of death. Just be careful not to kill it early because the true end requires you to kill it with a Final Strike.

User Info: Solarys

Solarys
1 month ago#4
Yeah, I also found the final form to be easier than the 2nd, and I almost killed it with my 3rd character (it now has 7% HP left, with body and wings sealed), so suicide bombing is out of the question for now.

I'm familiar with Mystery Dungeon games and mechanics, and one thing I like about this game is that it actually plays fair by giving you at least one turn to evade any AOE attack, whereas most MD games suffer from the unavoidable-damage problem. If you know what you are doing, Trillion is a piece of cake compared to, say, Primal Dialga from PMD Explorers, who starts the fight by 1HKOing both of you with an unavoidable Roar of Time, making it literally unwinnable without at least 2 Revival Seeds.
"Teamwork is essential, it gives them other people to shoot at."
MSI Z170A-S02 || Xeon E-2126G 4.1~4.5 GHz || 16 GB DDR4 2666 MHz || Radeon RX 480

User Info: BBQ_Soda

BBQ_Soda
1 month ago#5
Don't waste your money or good seals on the 4th character, since she's not only the most annoying one to please with gifts, but also the worst in battle thanks to her coming with Auto-Counter, which means you can't use minions to quickly build up Rage. Just get her to 100% and get rid of her ASAP.

Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if they were secretly trying to piss off ASMedia, like they did Nintendo in HDN.
With the others, you can at least figure out where their names are from without playing the game: Mammon, Leviathan, Belphegor, and Lucifer, with Beelzebub being a bit of a stretch. But Asmodeus is the last thing on my mind when I see the name "Ashmedia"...

User Info: Solarys

Solarys
1 month ago#6
No s***! I hate Auto-Counter, and the worst part about it is you don't even get "1 More" for killing minions this way. I wish you could turn it off like the IQ skills in PMD.

BTW, Asmodeus is also known as Ashmedai, so that's where her name is from, but yeah, ASMedia was also the first thing that came to my mind (I'd take ASM over VIA or Marvell any day, just for the better drivers). On that note, Elma is probably Samael, the angel of death, which explains why Uriel has a different attitude towards her.
"Teamwork is essential, it gives them other people to shoot at."
MSI Z170A-S02 || Xeon E-2126G 4.1~4.5 GHz || 16 GB DDR4 2666 MHz || Radeon RX 480

User Info: Solarys

Solarys
1 month ago#7
Just realized that Rage is completely useless on Ashmedia, or if you have Auto-Counter, because its bonus resets as soon as you hit something.

But unlike Final Sprint, Rage doesn't seem to have a cap, and it can definitely take your stats over 999 (although not displayed). I did some testing on Trillion's first form, and I did noticeably more damage after taking 10 or so more hits at 999 Attack, than immediately at 999 Attack - hope that makes sense. Also, Rage continues to work after Final Sprint hits its cap, which means if you have enough patience and luck, you might potentially one-shot each of Trillion's forms (assuming there is no cap on Rage).
"Teamwork is essential, it gives them other people to shoot at."
MSI Z170A-S02 || Xeon E-2126G 4.1~4.5 GHz || 16 GB DDR4 2666 MHz || Radeon RX 480

User Info: BBQ_Soda

BBQ_Soda
1 month ago#8
Solarys posted...
BTW, Asmodeus is also known as Ashmedai, so that's where her name is from...

Really? I guess you learn something new every day!

Solarys posted...
Just realized that Rage is completely useless on Ashmedia, or if you have Auto-Counter, because its bonus resets as soon as you hit something.

I'm pretty sure Rage only resets after you kill something, so you can just leave the minions alive to hit you while you attack Trillion. I might be wrong, since it's been a while.

Have you tested if Rage at 999 Attack still continues to boost Final Strike damage? You might want to use a fresh NG+ with Trillion at full HP, so it's easier to tell the exact damage.
Anyway, I don't think it's possible to do 350G damage with normal skills, even if there's no limit on Rage, as chances are you won't have enough turns before it crosses the line - at least not without some kind of invulnerability or infinite HP cheat (so you don't have to dodge AOEs). But if it works with Final Strike, then you might be able to pull it off.

User Info: Solarys

Solarys
4 weeks ago#9
BBQ_Soda posted...
Have you tested if Rage at 999 Attack still continues to boost Final Strike damage?

Yes, but Final Strike damage is definitely capped, and the most I could do with it was around 6% - less than a normal attack with Pierce Seal.

However, that Something-Fang skill at L3 can easily 1HKO its first 2 forms, but most or all of its hits must be critical to 1HKO the final form.
"Teamwork is essential, it gives them other people to shoot at."
MSI Z170A-S02 || Xeon E-2126G 4.1~4.5 GHz || 16 GB DDR4 2666 MHz || Radeon RX 480
In my first playthrough, I beat the game with Cerberus. Then in NG+, it got a lot easier once I knew all the strategies and such.

I assume you're using battle skills to jump from one place to the next instead of just walking? Because that will boost your attack with the right passive skill, I forget what it's called.

Stocking up on items is probably more important than upgrading your weapon, at least in my experience. Getting the passive skills which increase item use is always first on my list.

In each playthrough, remember to fight Mokujin as often as possible. Delay the fight against Trillion until you absolutely have to in order to gain as many boosts/skills as you can get. Although the game claims that the Ring of the Conqueror will pass on all the talent points you gain in the game, I believe there's a limit? Or the points are only those which you spent on your character? Because it doesn't seem like they all transferred.

The best skill I found is something called Flash Step. You get it by choosing the correct answer (in my experience, whispering) when "Turn Back the Clock" event appears. Flash Step will let you move about the field to different places, and is very useful (if costly).

The playstyle that works best for me has been attacking from a long distance, running out of shield points (whatever the points you get that are earned through discussions), at which point the damage boost and defense boosts kick in. as long as you don't get hit too often and can avoid poison squares, this is a good opportunity to get in lots and lots of damage. I think I topped out around 30 billion.
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