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User Info: Averlus

Averlus
5 years ago#471
Yeah, I don't know about making it shoot twice. I'd have to commandeer an unused special effect (easy part) then figure out how to make it fire twice (not so easy part). I think a power bump should be fine; narratively, it can just be a new design that increases the velocity of the bolts being fired.

A guy on the FF6 hacking forums had the idea to make the attack split like Coin Toss. I don't know that I like that idea, but I thought I'd bring it up anyway.
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User Info: Goombacrusher

Goombacrusher
5 years ago#472
I think the punishment for using Ice3 on Atma is a bit too harsh. It's a fight that can take half an hour for some people, so dropping a nuke on players for not reading your mind is kinda a dick move. It's not like this is a "DON'T ATTACK THE SHELL" situation, there's no indicator that casting Ice3 is bad here and it's something a player will naturally do if they have the option available. I get that it's kinda supposed to punish level grinders, but the Floating Continent is by its very nature a difficulty spike, and so is Atma. Between running to and from save points to use tents, and most likely leaving the continent to rethink your party and having to do another run through it, it's not that hard for someone who's using Celes a good amount to get to a high enough level to learn Ice3 without doing any purposeful grinding. So dropping a nuke on the party is too harsh a punishment for that. If you're gonna punish using Ice3, do it in a way that doesn't completely f*** over the player, but gets across the message that "Relying on this spell isn't going to be a viable strategy"
kawaii!

User Info: BTB

BTB
5 years ago#473
Yeah, I saw that. It's probably not a good idea; GP Toss's special split formula is really wonky and is only balanced within the confines of the one special attack it applies to, I think.

225 power should be fine.
"Good luck and good gaming." -Klaravoyia

User Info: BTB

BTB
5 years ago#474
Goombacrusher posted...
I think the punishment for using Ice3 on Atma is a bit too harsh. It's a fight that can take half an hour for some people, so dropping a nuke on players for not reading your mind is kinda a dick move. It's not like this is a "DON'T ATTACK THE SHELL" situation, there's no indicator that casting Ice3 is bad here and it's something a player will naturally do if they have the option available.


I'm honestly beginning to wonder how many people here ever played FF4, because Atma Weapon's counter is taken straight out of Zeromous's playbook; if you cast Holy or Meteo on him, he'd respond by rightly f'ing Rydia or Rosa into a fine paste.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I learned really quickly to leave the fighting up to Cecil and Kain while using Rydia and Rosa to heal.
"Good luck and good gaming." -Klaravoyia

User Info: Goombacrusher

Goombacrusher
5 years ago#475
BTB posted...
Goombacrusher posted...
I think the punishment for using Ice3 on Atma is a bit too harsh. It's a fight that can take half an hour for some people, so dropping a nuke on players for not reading your mind is kinda a dick move. It's not like this is a "DON'T ATTACK THE SHELL" situation, there's no indicator that casting Ice3 is bad here and it's something a player will naturally do if they have the option available.


I'm honestly beginning to wonder how many people here ever played FF4, because Atma Weapon's counter is taken straight out of Zeromous's playbook; if you cast Holy or Meteo on him, he'd respond by rightly f'ing Rydia or Rosa into a fine paste.


I played FF4DS and while Zeromus did have a harsh counter for those attacks, i don't recall it being a complete "F*** you this fight is basically unwinnable now". If I remember correctly it was something that you could just toss one of your (probably numerous, since it was the end of the game and all) elixirs at and say "Alright, I'm not gonna try that again."

With Atma though, if 2 or 3 of your party members dies you've practically lost the fight, and unless you've deliberately prepared for the counter attack (which is impossible to see coming) you're gonna lose 2 or 3 party members
kawaii!

User Info: BTB

BTB
5 years ago#476
Well, I'm also assuming that anyone who waltzes into that fight leveled enough to have Ice 3 (which, for the record, is several levels above what's expected) is going to bust it out fairly early on, so not much progress is going to be lost.

That said, I've seen people recover from it before.
"Good luck and good gaming." -Klaravoyia

User Info: Goombacrusher

Goombacrusher
5 years ago#477
BTB posted...
Well, I'm also assuming that anyone who waltzes into that fight leveled enough to have Ice 3 (which, for the record, is several levels above what's expected) is going to bust it out fairly early on, so not much progress is going to be lost.

That said, I've seen people recover from it before.


Most people might use it early on, but I feel like there are inevitably gonna be people who don't use it initially for whatever reason, and if they don't try it until the second half of the fight...yeah that would be really really frustrating to say the least.

I just think the punishment should be lightened a bit. Maybe have him drain a ton of MP from Celes or something, a harsh punishment but something that the average player could probably bounce back from the first time they run into it and know that using Ice3 in this fight isn't worth the price of admission
kawaii!

User Info: BTB

BTB
5 years ago#478
Ok, so the Zantetsuken hack we're working on... are we going to be able to do the same thing with the Odin summon?

I assume a free spell slot will be required, and it looks like I will be able to easily free up one at index 154. That said, I should probably tidy up this mess I've made in the middle of the spell index while I'm at it. Can you move the Defibrillator and Mana Battery pointers from 157 and 158, respectively, to 155 and 156, respectively?
"Good luck and good gaming." -Klaravoyia

User Info: Averlus

Averlus
5 years ago#479
It depends. I can probably re-write that effect to cast the spell as normal if the target is death-immune, but do damage otherwise without hijacking another spell slot. I'll test it at some point and let you know.
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User Info: BTB

BTB
5 years ago#480
Death-immune, or flagged as a boss?
"Good luck and good gaming." -Klaravoyia
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