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  3. Non-HoF Insane run with Bard 17, 5 others 1
Laclongquan 3 years ago#1
It's not the powergaming mechanic of getting new level 1 chars into party to reduce APL. No, it's not that.

It's the idea of engage IWD2 at Insane diff, with APL set at medium range to start.

With APL at 3-4, depended on your builds, the game increase spawn (and reduce xp gains accordingly). You might have more loots, depended on the type of creature, but equal or less xp.

Leader (1st slot) Bard 16-17. You got highest utility skill levels from start: Bluff, Diplomacy. Intimidate is so so. You dont have overpowered character at your disposal because talkee Bard is not like that, unlike wizard17, or Cleric17, or Pa17...

With 5 other character at Effective character level of 1-3 (depend on race) you will have minimum of APL 3.8, which get scaled down at 3. Adjust your total partylevel at 23 to keep APL at that number. Or if you must, increase it straight to 29 to play at APL 4.8.

The goblins in Targos is spawned according to your APL, so an APL 20 spawn super goblins. If you keep at APL 3.8, they will be tougher than normal, but not that tough.

I might try this after I finish the HoF run.
Bloody ass you all, I love The Wheel of Time series https://teespring.com/stores/the-wheel-of-time-tshirt
militant agnostic 3 years ago#2
I would say Bard 17 is better than Paladin 17. Paladin is really just a dip class. Bards get a pretty decent spell pool.
"The rantings of an upjumped zealot make for tedious listening." -Grigori
Laclongquan 3 years ago#3
Bard is support-only.

The offensive spells are really lacking. I find that the wands of lightning is more useful, though Chromatic Orbs is okay, ditto with the Dire Charm.

I use Greater Conj summon more than Mass Haste, though the amount of high level slot make it a once-per-battle chance.

Bard is innate wand user, more so than arcane casters~.

Paladin on the hand make a really great meatshield with high save and Draw Upon Holy Might for extra HP. But it need Fighter 4 in order to master weapons, or melee damage would be really lacking. The goblin slaying dagger on the hand of Paladin can make him go through the horde like hot knife through butter. Although my favourite tactic is to have Paladin smash enemies in the face while right behind him a Fighter4Cleric will attack with spear or halberd. Longhandle weapons certainly have the range.

For initial battles of chapter 0-2, paladin17 is too powerful, unlike bard17.
Bloody ass you all, I love The Wheel of Time series https://teespring.com/stores/the-wheel-of-time-tshirt
militant agnostic 3 years ago#4
Being able to throw out mirror images, status effects and summon is better than a straight up Paladin. This is especially true in HoF.

Sorc or Cleric with a Paladin dip on the other hand...
"The rantings of an upjumped zealot make for tedious listening." -Grigori
Laclongquan 3 years ago#5
If you play Bard as support only, even in Leader position, just move her back to rear area soonest, then you dont need mirror image. My Bard is robe only, with maybe a Ghost Armor thrown in for caution.

Paladin, when he can cast Draw Upon Holy Might, can buff himself with extra HP come from buffed Endurance. A high endurance, even before Drawed, with high save, and the tower shield, meaning he can stay on frontline even against boss for long, buying time for cleric and wizard to cast high level spell. Meatshield, yo~

Of course, my party has both. However, Paladin can not stay in 1st slot, Leader position, because many automatic dialog start with that, and Pal's skills in dialog is not enough. You need Bard with her specifically invested skill point in Diplomacy and Bluff.

So Bard will do better in quest negotiation than Paladin, yet not unbalance the party. Paladin can carry 5 other newbies, not Bard.
Bloody ass you all, I love The Wheel of Time series https://teespring.com/stores/the-wheel-of-time-tshirt
SwordMagess 3 years ago#6
Laclongquan posted...
With 5 other character at Effective character level of 1-3 (depend on race) you will have minimum of APL 3.8, which get scaled down at 3.

I was under the impression that IWD2 uses character level, not ECL, to determine encounter difficulty and exp gain, so the level 1 characters would be level 1 for calculating APL, not level 1-4.
Assamite Law: In any game where there are no monsters [...], the players will be stalked by assassins with alarming consistency. - RPG Cliche List
militant agnostic 3 years ago#7
It does, ECL only modifies XP requirements, not average character level.
"The rantings of an upjumped zealot make for tedious listening." -Grigori
Laclongquan 3 years ago#8
If you are curious It's simple to test this.

Kill xp is calculated based on average party level (effective level, not actual).

Create a party of 2, each one human level 1. That mean APL should be 1.0. Appear in Targos Dock.

Kill a few goblin in Targos to test xp gains.

Add a gnome level 1, his effective level should be 4. That mean APL should be 2 ((1+1+4)/3=2). And kill xp should be lower than initially.

If kill xp gain is the same, that means APL of three equal to APL of two and is 1 and effective level doesnt affect xp gain.
====================
Or you can test backward

Create a party of 2, each one gnome level 1, his effective level should be 4. That mean APL should be 4.0. Appear in Targos Dock.

Kill a few goblin in Targos to test xp gains.

Add a human level 1, . That mean APL should be 2.67 ((4+4+1)/3=2.67 rounded down as 2 for purpose of calculate kill xp). And kill xp should be higher than initially.

If kill xp gain is the same, that means APL is 1 and effective level doesnt affect xp gain.
Bloody ass you all, I love The Wheel of Time series https://teespring.com/stores/the-wheel-of-time-tshirt
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