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  3. Loving Final Fantasy Zz Hard-Type!

User Info: flamefox777

4 months ago#1
Though I haven't been around for about nine years, I was once quite active on these forums. I'm not that into challenges for this game. I defeated the game with a solo Red Wizard, if that can be considered a challenge, but that's all I've done. A couple duo runs as well. Stuff like that. No solo Thief or level 8 White Mage runs or whatever. Those don't appeal to me personally, but I do really like hearing about others taking the time and having the dedication to do so.

After receiving my cartridge for renewing my subscription to Nintendo Power around my tenth Christmas, I fell fast in love with this game. Advanced Dungeons & Dragons in video game format? Favorite game ever! Dragon Warrior, also gifted to me through my parents from Nintendo Power, became the children's version of the genre for me.

I generally played through both Final Fantasy and Dragon Warrior every year, but I guess I've been slacking for the last decade. Time flies.

Anyway, I'm currently playing through Zzonk's Final Fantasy Zz Hard-Type Version 2.3 and am really loving it! It is available here: http://www.romhacking.net/hacks/1278/

Here is the most current mega-thread and strategy guide for the hack: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/522595-final-fantasy/74794569

I downloaded Lunar IPS and patched my ROM quickly and easily. Wish I would have gotten into this ROM hacking stuff sooner!

I'm really enjoying the hack so far, though I may never actually finish it.

I began with two Fighters, Jace and Dane; a White Mage, Rose; and a Black Mage, Kane. I really would have liked to take a Red Mage or Thief in the second spot, but this being my first time, I went with the two heavy-hitting linebackers for simplicity.

For the first time practically ever, after hearing warnings of increased difficulty, I leveled to 3 to fight everyone's favorite Christmas decoration.

Woo! Great fight! The instant before he died, he hit one of my fighters with DART, doing the exact HP needed to kill him. The very next instant, the fight was over and my jaw was hanging open. I was happy and relieved on one hand, red-faced mad on the other. Bravo, Zzonk!

I'm a huge fan of black magic despite it being vastly underwhelming in the original game. Such a simple and obvious choice to make the basic elemental spells target the whole enemy party! Like, of course that should be the way they work! I always thought that.

(Part 1/2)

User Info: flamefox777

4 months ago#2
At first, I thought there was way too much sleep and paralysis, but I understand that it's part of the re-balance and that the MOVE spell is used to help offset the increase (I would have called it WAKE, by the way). I'm still not sold that there isn't too much stunning, but we'll see. The trouble with thinking the MOVE spell will offset the significant increase in stunning is that the condition doesn't usually last all that long and will quickly get re-applied when it wears off naturally. It feels like a waste of a spell to cast MOVE. At the same time, the increase feels a bit cheap and contrived—like why are the Pirates putting us to sleep with their swords? I understand a monster that belches sleep gas or whatever, but pirates? This may change later, just an observation. Not a complaint.

I really feel it when one character is taken out, though! Like, the "back line" is important! The Black Mage isn't just for fun and cool factor! Everyone is needed and has an important role. It's not like Blue Team is just there to tag along and witness Red Team being awesome.

I am now at level 5/6 having beaten the Pirates. One of my Fighters has a saber, the other a hand axe. My WM has CURE, HARM and MOVE, SLEP and my BM has FIR, LIT and RUN!, ICE. I'm open to suggestions to fill remaining level 1, 2 or 3 magic slots.

Anyway, thanks Zzonk and co for making this wonderful re-balance of my third favorite game of all time! Loving it so far!

My team:

User Info: flamefox777

4 months ago#3
I've made it to the Marsh Cave, a place of nightmare from my childhood. Paralysis and poison; the eerie green color; the catastrophic (compared to outside) first dungeon experience; and distance from the nearest town all combined to create a symphony of fear and hate for my childhood. Of course, the Marsh Cave is only the Ice Cave's little brother, but I digress.

I wonder what terrors await this time . . .

So far, it seems as though healing—while leveling on the overworld at least—is a bit less important than in the original, if my memory serves me. That's almost certainly because of the increase in gill while the price for healing potions and a night at the inn has stayed the same. That's made the game feel a lot less grindy and I applaud the re-balance.

Making each battle tougher, more complex, and yet more rewarding has greatly reduced the grind while making the game more fun.

Glad I had the MOVE spell while on the way to the Marsh Cave!


Here's my team:


EDIT: Went north and then down, then south and cleared out everything. I think I have one more room or level before the Wizards. I'm not looking at maps or anything. Just going by memory with the understanding that there is some differences in this hack.

My current team, hunting the Wizards:


User Info: flamefox777

4 months ago#4
Can't edit last message anymore, so an update:

Found the Wizards!

Tricky how the passage to get to them from the floor above wasn't directly obvious!

That inescapable fight right before the Wizards, though. Gah.

My first clash with the Wizards didn't go so well! I haven't looked at their abilities or anything. I'm totally blind to the mechanics of the fight.


Round 1

WM cast INVS.
Sorcerer casts TRANCE, taking out both Fighters.
BM cast FAST on second Fighter
A Wizard's elemental spell hits us all hard, I think it was LIT.

Round 2

Fighter with FAST attacks, but only does one hit (maybe since he has a hand axe?), though it's for 105 damage against Sorcerer.
Sorcerer retaliates, attacking the same fighter, but doing only 2 damage.
Wizard casts LIT again, but not so bad this time. We're all still just barely about 100 HP. Fighter 1 is still stunned.
Wizard then casts MUTE, which my WM resists but black mage doesn't. Ouch! Fighter 1 is stunned and BM is mute! I have ESNA (whatever that name means), but no spell charges . . .
WM casts INVS again, didn't know if it was worth it when I picked it, but didn't know what else to do at that time.
BM tried casting HOLD, but was muted. Don't know if it would have worked, but I sure wish it wouldn't take a spell charge in that case . . .

Round 3

Fighter 1 is still stunned.
Sorcerer insta-kills Fighter 2 and I know I'm pretty well done at that point.
A spell is cast by the enemy on the enemy, and I think it was heal, so now I know it's hopeless.
Wizard then casts MUTE, getting my WM this time, utterly sealing our fate.
Another LIT2 spell hits and we're all below 100 HP.

Round 4

Fighter 1 still stunned, Fighter 2 dead, and with only muted BM and WM, I reset.

I'll have to try again tomorrow!

EDIT: Of course, I couldn't let tonight's session end that way. I went into the fight this time guns blazing. BM casts LIT2 to start round 1. Both Fighters attacked the Sorcerer, killing him before he can even act once. Both evil Wizards cast LIT2, shocking us all, but we were still above 100 HP. WM swings her silver hammer to end the round. First move in round 2, BM casts LIT2, killing both Wizards! Done in the first move of Round 2! *Fanfare music plays!*

EDITx2: What?! The Lute?! Oh, boy. Looks like I've got some exploring to do! I wondered why the princess didn't give it to me, but I forgot . . . Very cool!

Holy cow what a harrowing fight out. I immediately forgot about the spiked square in front of the Wizards, but it didn't matter as I wasn't hurt. Good thing!

I barely made it out! Basically no magic at all left, and no healing potions! I think I started with about 35.


Love this hack!

User Info: beege_man

4 months ago#5
I'm very much enjoying reading this. =)
L37 409/409 9/8/8/8/7/7/6/6 HP8 Pa3 Int/MDef: 51/92
HDCEA: 102-97-92/48-50-43/3-4-6.5/81/43(34) Resist: (Fire)/(Lit)/Death AtkElem: Ice-Fire-Coral

User Info: MysticGreever

4 months ago#6
Its really great to hear positive feedback for this hack, I'll be starting mine probably next weekend.

As much as I'd like to follow along in this thread, I can't. I want to experience Zzonks hack firsthand and recapture that new game feel.

Enjoy Flamefox! Godspeed!
PSN: MystykkGreever / Currently Playing: My NES and SNES backlog. FF3 then DW2.

User Info: flamefox777

4 months ago#7

I took myself off the menu at Astos' banquet.

The first time I faced him, I went straight from Elfland to his castle, but was quickly annihilated. That was a stupid mistake. I should have remembered that Astos' thing was RUB right at the start, so I should have known better than not to camp right outside.

It took three more tries, but I got 'em!


We were all on level 11. It was a fun fight!

I FAST'ed both my Fighters right out the gate. One was quickly insta-killed, as I expected. In fact, if it was going to happen, that's who I wanted to go down.

Other than FAST, the Black Mage's magic wasn't helping much. The Dark Elf must be resistant to elements and status attacks. I never could get him stunned or to sleep and ICE/LIT/FIR wasn't putting out any sort of numbers. My BM was killed right at the very end by a single hard hit, I think from BOMB, if I remember correctly. He had been relegated to potion duty (a.k.a. "water boy") by then anyway.

My remaining Fighter and White Mage were both doing pretty well when he fell, and the Fighter was hitting like a truck to the tune of 100-175 damage. He was using a flachion. The other Fighter still had a hand axe from Pravoka.

Currently, I'm at the mouth of the Earth Cave with no idea how the Crown is used or where it's located—or even if it's still in the game. Apparently, it wasn't what Astos was after since he took the lute. Very cool! If the Vampire is still lurking down there, I wonder what dangers the encounter will bring?

Can't wait to find out what's next!


Suggestion about the battle(s): I really didn't like the spiked square before the Wizards (annoying, not challenging), but I could totally see one before the door to his throne room. A door guard, in other words. Keep the player from machine-gun attempts.

Suggestion about gill inflation and equipment: There's a lot of inflation of the Gill in this hack almost to the point where it's been debased. Potions, inns and such are cheap, and that hurts the WM a bit. That's not necessarily a bad thing; in fact, I like it as explained before. However, while the price of spells is perfect (nailed it!), equipment is still a bit cheap.

Elfland's weapon shop was a big disappointment, and I'm not talking about the silver sword. Melmond's wasn't much better. My BM had no weapon at all (wooden staff be damned) when I went through almost all of the Marsh Cave up until the point where I found a silver knife. I understand that chests should contain valuable treasure, but the dichotomy of "buy now or find later" is a big staple of both this game and the genre.

I'd strongly suggest a silver knife in Elfland's weapon shop. It would be balanced (if it weren't it wouldn't have been in that chest), and it would also be a nod to both the "buy now or find later" and the silver sword of the original. A win-win-win. Furthermore, I would also put the next step up from the hand axe in Elfland so as to continue the "axe or sword?" dichotomy.

User Info: flamefox777

4 months ago#8
beege_man posted...
I'm very much enjoying reading this. =)

Beege! Still around after all these years. I'm glad you're along for the ride! Here's hoping I remain dedicated enough to slay Chaos!

I usually make it all the way to the ToF before I lose interest, if I end up faltering. Dunno why, that's just the spot where if I quit, that's the place.

MysticGreever posted...
Its really great to hear positive feedback for this hack, I'll be starting mine probably next weekend.

As much as I'd like to follow along in this thread, I can't. I want to experience Zzonks hack firsthand and recapture that new game feel.

Enjoy Flamefox! Godspeed!

Hey, good luck to you too! It was your thread that reminded me of this project. I remembered it from back in the day but I didn't really want to play "faux FF" when I could play the real thing. Plus, I didn't trust that some rando on the Internet could or would really make a good "remix." Sorry, Zzonk!

Totally understand about not following this thread!


Part of the fun in this is not having a guide. I actually have to explore the dungeons! But, they're still very familiar—so far, at least. Best of both worlds. Almost the same, but not quite.

It's like I'm playing Final Fantasy for the first time. It's not a formula or just a trip down Nostalgia Lane. It's a game again!

Even if I never play this again—my favorite part of the game having been completed with the detonation of the TNT—this has been a worthwhile download and play. I'd highly recommend this hack to Final Fantasy veterans.

Thanks a lot, Zzonk!

User Info: beege_man

4 months ago#9
flamefox777 posted...
The Dark Elf must be resistant to elements and status attacks. I never could get him stunned or to sleep and ICE/LIT/FIR wasn't putting out any sort of numbers.

Yeah, he has super high Magic Defense and resistance to most elements. This is an encounter where DART comes in handy for the BM. I see you didn't grab it so this recommendation is moot, but it's non-elemental, so it gives your BM a decent damage option in fights against resistant foes. I usually take it instead of either FIRE or LIT since at the start of the game either element is about the same and you'll have FIR2/LIT2 soon.
L37 409/409 9/8/8/8/7/7/6/6 HP8 Pa3 Int/MDef: 51/92
HDCEA: 102-97-92/48-50-43/3-4-6.5/81/43(34) Resist: (Fire)/(Lit)/Death AtkElem: Ice-Fire-Coral


4 months ago#10
To answer your question, yes the Crown is found in a future dungeon and is required for something different..
Astos, on the other hand...[...]. You're an amusement to him. You're the god damned blue haired jester, and he's gonna make you dance to his tune.
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