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  3. Christians face immense defections after refusing to stop demonizing homosexuals

User Info: UnfairRepresent

UnfairRepresent
3 months ago#1
The second-largest Protestant denomination in the country is facing the prospect of mass defections and acts of defiance after delegates at a conference in St. Louis voted Tuesday to strengthen the United Methodist Church's bans on same-sex marriage and the ordination of LGBTQ clergy.

After three days of intense discussions at the General Conference Special Session, 56 percent of the 800 delegates in attendance voted in favor of a proposal by conservatives called Traditional Plan, which upholds the church's stance prohibiting LGBTQ members from being ordained and does not permit same-sex couples to be married.

"It's obviously crushing," delegate J.J. Warren from New York told FOX2. Warren, who is gay and was in the process of becoming ordained, called the vote "incredibly painful."

The Traditional Plan's success was due to an alliance of conservatives from the U.S. and overseas. About 43 percent of the delegates were from abroad, mostly from Africa, and the overseas delegates overwhelmingly supported the LGBT bans. Membership in the church has been growing in locations such as Africa and Asia.

If the bans were eased, "the church in Africa would cease to exist," said the Rev. Jerry Kulah of Liberia. The deep split within the church was evident in several fiery speeches opposing the Traditional Plan.

"If we bring this virus into our church, it will bring illness to us all," said the Rev. Thomas Berlin of Herndon, Virginia.

Council of Bishops President Kenneth H. Carter, speaking at a news conference after the session, said the meeting in St. Louis was necessary "because if the impasse we found ourselves in" over questions of human sexuality.

"I would just simply say that we have work to do. We did not accomplish that in these three days," Carter said. He added he was concerned the plan will cause progressive churches to leave the denomination.

"Persons will feel harmed," he said.

Formed in a merger in 1968, the United Methodist Church claims about 12.6 million members worldwide, including nearly 7 million in the United States. High-profile church members include former Attorney General Jeff Sessions, ex-Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and former first lady Laura Bush. After the vote was complete, dozens of people filled the lobby outside the convention hall at the Dome at America's Center to sing, pray and support one another,

While other mainline Protestant denominations, such as the Episcopal and Presbyterian (U.S.A.) churches, have embraced gay-friendly practices, the Methodist church still bans them, though acts of defiance by pro-LGBTQ clergy have increased. Many have performed same-sex weddings; others have come out as gay or lesbian from the pulpit of their churches. Enforcement of the bans has been inconsistent, but that could change under the Traditional Plan.

The Rev. Tim Bagwell, 64, pastor at a UMC church in Macon, Georgia, had opposed the Traditional Plan and called the outcome "deeply painful." But he said his church will stay with UMC until at least 2020, when the next major conference is scheduled. He's hopeful new delegates will be elected and change course to a more inclusive church.

"I am deeply sad. The Methodist church has always been mainstream, reaching out to people. This sends a different tone...one of exclusion, not inclusion."


Full Article: https://www.foxnews.com/us/united-methodist-delegates-reject-recognizing-gay-marriage
https://i.imgtc.com/9NTmGlc.png
80/80

Wow they literally flew in hundreds of Christians from Africa solely to stop gay acceptance.

That is going above and beyond in terms of effort. Imagine if instead they used that same passion, time, energy and money to help other human beings rather than bully and oppress them.

Oh well.
^ Hey now that's completely Merry!
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User Info: the_hedonist

the_hedonist
3 months ago#2
1. Do African Methodists have less of a say in what happens in the UMC?

2. Do you have evidence that more African Methodists came this year than would be normal for a General Conference?
Resurgam.

User Info: the_hedonist

the_hedonist
3 months ago#3
As to #2, I went ahead and did some digging out of curiosity. The General Conference is typically held once every four years, the last being held in 2016. A special session was called in order to “focus on the issue of human sexuality and church unity with the goals of ending distracting and mission-compromising disagreement about how to be in ministry with LGBTQI people.“ The session was called by the bishops of the UMC. My understanding is that bishops in general were in favor of the One Church Plan, so I’m pretty sure this was not some traditionalist/conservative takeover of the UMC.

What about the number of delegates from Africa?

Each United Methodist annual and missionary conference in Africa, Asia, Europe and the United States elects an equal number of clergy and laity to be among the 600 to 1,000 delegates constituting each General Conference. Other delegates come from General Conference-approved concordat or autonomous Methodist churches. For example, the Methodist Church in Great Britain sends four delegates to each General Conference. The special session of General Conference will have 864 delegates, as did the 2016 assembly. Most of the delegates to the special session will have also served in 2016.

A formula determines the number of delegates from each conference. Every conference is guaranteed at least two — one clergy and one lay. In 2016, the largest delegations came from North Katanga (48) and Côte d’Ivoire (34). The largest delegations from conferences in the United States were from Virginia and Western North Carolina (22 each). Most of the conferences in Europe and the Philippines had two delegates, as did nine in the United States.

Around 41.7% of the 2016/2019 delegates come from outside the United States. Thirty percent of 2016 delegates came from Africa and just under 6 percent each from Europe and the Philippines.
(Emphasis mine)

http://www.umcom.org/news/q-a-2019-special-session-of-the-general-conference

So to be clear, Africans were not flown in specially in order to win this vote. The number of delegates is determined in a way independent of theological persuasion.
Resurgam.

User Info: OrangeWizard

OrangeWizard
3 months ago#4
Well we can't let a little thing like fake news get in the way of Unfair's agenda!

User Info: UnfairRepresent

UnfairRepresent
3 months ago#5
OrangeWizard posted...
Well we can't let a little thing like fake news get in the way of Unfair's agenda!

What agenda?

What are you on about?

You're damage controlling before you even know what's been damaged.
^ Hey now that's completely Merry!
https://i.imgtc.com/YnvkpvU.png

User Info: OrangeWizard

OrangeWizard
3 months ago#6
And you aren't denying the accusation that you fell hook, line and sinker for fake news.

User Info: SSj4Wingzero

SSj4Wingzero
3 months ago#7
Falling for fake news seems to be his gimmick

Like when he shared the story about how a school "locked a kid in a closet" even though it literally never happened.

He wants to demonize religion but he wants to take the easy way out. There are plenty of legitimate gripes with religious institutions to an extent that you *don't* have to resort to fake news
Not changing this sig until the Knicks win the NBA Championship! Started...4/23/2011? Or was it 2010?
(edited 3 months ago)

User Info: UnfairRepresent

UnfairRepresent
3 months ago#8
SSj4Wingzero posted...


Like when he shared the story about how a school "locked a kid in a closet" even though it literally never happened.

Wut?

Yes it did.

You just got semantic over "its not a closet they locked the girl in, it was just a small confined space where they hang coats"

And what about this story is fake?

Either apologize right now for lying or I'm putting you on ignore for trolling. You choice.
^ Hey now that's completely Merry!
https://i.imgtc.com/YnvkpvU.png

User Info: SSj4Wingzero

SSj4Wingzero
3 months ago#9
Oh gosh, I'm going to get put on ignore for trolling so I can't see any more fake news posts! The horror!
Not changing this sig until the Knicks win the NBA Championship! Started...4/23/2011? Or was it 2010?

User Info: 3127

3127
3 months ago#10
Good. I prefer watching people change for their religions, then religions change for their people. I would rather every uncommitted person leave their religion, leaving the committed ones remaining, then have an entire religion betray thousands of years of commitment just to suit the interests of a small percentage of human beings it doesn’t need at all anyway. If a gay person wants to be religious then they can always find some other religion or create their own. But do not be surprised to find that many religious groups to not have an open door policy towards those who do not meet their standards or align with their interests. I completely approve.
331212777
(edited 3 months ago)
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