• Topic Archived
You're browsing the GameFAQs Message Boards as a guest. Sign Up for free (or Log In if you already have an account) to be able to post messages, change how messages are displayed, and view media in posts.
  1. Boards
  2. Devil May Cry 5
  3. What exactly was wrong with DmC's combat?

User Info: Delta123456789

Delta123456789
8 months ago#11
Yeah, DmC was a solid B-grade action title that I think would have been judged a lot more favourably had it not had the DMC name attached. I'd actually like to see Ninja Theory iterate on it and polish up the flaws because it had potential, and goodness knows not enough studios are making this type of game nowadays.

The bosses I think were a big weak point though. Most were just "whale on the weak point, QTE to dodge/change location, repeat" IIRC. The succubus fight in particular was bad for that "Oop, she's prepping to destroy the platform for like the third time this fight, better grapple away and watch the exact same cutscene again". There were almost no straight brawls with enemies close to your size IIRC, the closest being the hunter demon at the start (which was kind of a joke).

The Vergil's Downfall DLC was especially good I thought. It kept the story stuff to a minimum and let you just dash from fight to fight if you knew where you were going, and the Vergil gameplay was satisfying and nicely different from the main game (if a bit broken, seeing as well-timed charge attacks could launch every enemy, even the Nightmare miniboss). You can tell the designers really liked DMC Vergil and they did a good job implementing a Yamato moveset IMO.
If you're a success odds are darned good you got help, support and/or a few second chances along the way, so think long and hard before denying them to others.

User Info: rene48

rene48
8 months ago#12
Raeng posted...
Mechanically it is a fine action title that allows for numerous styles of play, like efficiency through ring-outs - something the game even rewards. Game also has a pretty fun control-setup and introduced some unique enemy types we'd see return or at least inspired by them.

There's a lot of good in it. The bad stuff was mostly in terms the original version's performance, emphasis on story, long load times and the combat being a step back. Because DmC was intended to just be something new, instead it was a wattered down version of DMC4's combat. Slower, less options, worse enemies (if you can believe it), terrible bosses. And of course the color-coded enemies which are the antithesis of a game such as this. Not to mention the bad marketing where both the developers, publisher and media regarded the current fanbase as "losers", did not win them favours.

The definitive edition, or apology-edition, is very good. It doesn't offer quite the combo creativity that 3 and 4 do, or the finely tuned balance of 1 etc. But it is a good action game. There are a lot of worse action games to buy.
Gonna have to disagree here. DmC definitely has more combo creativity than DMC 3, simply by the fact that you have access to everything. And it has the same amount of options as DMC 4. Also DmC is no slower than any of the other DMC games. At least DmC doesn't have that stupid mechanic where you have to build speed before you can run. And the enemies are no worse then the gimmicky bulls*** enemies in DMC 3 and 4
Correct a fool and he will hate you; correct a wise man and he will appreciate you.

User Info: kollie89

kollie89
8 months ago#13
Oh god I blocked DmCs horrible bosses from my mind. That’s definitely on top of the list of problems, combat is only as good as the things you’re beating on
https://twitter.com/ScrubQuotesX/status/1192803964686749696

User Info: Delta123456789

Delta123456789
8 months ago#14
I agree the movement in DmC felt good (you could speed between combat sections pretty quickly a lot of the time, outside some plot-mandated walking segments). Saying it has the same number of options as 4 seems dubious to me given the lack of a style system, though I do think they gave you a decent sized moveset in spite of that. As for DMC3 that's had style switching for years on PC and now Switch too so I don't think that comparison stands up.

You know thinking about it I kind of wonder how Donte and Vogon would feel to play if you ported them to DMC5 and benefitted from the better enemy and boss design. They're both highly mobile and probably kind of broken what with the likes of demon dodge, but I think there might actually be some potential in their moveset if you tweaked the balance a bit to tone down the broken parts (like the damage buff from demon dash or Dante's DT suspending enemies).

In terms of sheer number of options Donte is definitely behind mainline Dante but probably ahead of Nero, which goes to show what a difference having a game to yourself makes (although quality obviously matters more than sheer quantity). I also think it's kind of cool how big a moveset they were able to give Donte without resorting to a style system (though I guess the angel/devil system has some similarities).

There is stuff to like in DmC so I think would be a shame to pretend it never happened, though unfortunately Capcom hasn't always taken the best lessons from it (like adopting the modern city setting but not all the artistic flair that DmC had, and ending up bland visually as a result).
If you're a success odds are darned good you got help, support and/or a few second chances along the way, so think long and hard before denying them to others.

User Info: pablofreak88

pablofreak88
8 months ago#15
Delta123456789 posted...
I agree the movement in DmC felt good (you could speed between combat sections pretty quickly a lot of the time, outside some plot-mandated walking segments). Saying it has the same number of options as 4 seems dubious to me given the lack of a style system, though I do think they gave you a decent sized moveset in spite of that. As for DMC3 that's had style switching for years on PC and now Switch too so I don't think that comparison stands up.

You know thinking about it I kind of wonder how Donte and Vogon would feel to play if you ported them to DMC5 and benefitted from the better enemy and boss design. They're both highly mobile and probably kind of broken what with the likes of demon dodge, but I think there might actually be some potential in their moveset if you tweaked the balance a bit to tone down the broken parts (like the damage buff from demon dash or Dante's DT suspending enemies).

In terms of sheer number of options Donte is definitely behind mainline Dante but probably ahead of Nero, which goes to show what a difference having a game to yourself makes (although quality obviously matters more than sheer quantity). I also think it's kind of cool how big a moveset they were able to give Donte without resorting to a style system (though I guess the angel/devil system has some similarities).

There is stuff to like in DmC so I think would be a shame to pretend it never happened, though unfortunately Capcom hasn't always taken the best lessons from it (like adopting the modern city setting but not all the artistic flair that DmC had, and ending up bland visually as a result).
DmC wasted a lot on their button layout, I commented on another topic.

User Info: pablofreak88

pablofreak88
8 months ago#16
It is a good game, it really is, or atleast DE is. By removing lock on they removed input moves (Lock on+Back+Triangle=Launcher for example), which limited their button layout. They didn't use a Dial a Combo system, which limited their button layout. DT uses L3+R3, which limited their button layout. Dodge or Evade is mapped to 2 different buttons, which limited their button layout.

They used a butchered up version of Light and Heavy attack buttons because heavy button is default launcher or in the air deafult grounder(I guess?). So that button only has 2 uses. If they had hold Heavy to launch like Classic GoW, then we could have gotten Light Attack combos and Heavy Attack combos + launchers. They didn't, which limited their button layout. They separated Melee weapons in 2 categories Angel (Fast) and Devil (Slow) With one button each to change between them, which limited their button layout.
Obviously it wasn't trying to be mechanically complex, but still.

User Info: UnclePhil88

UnclePhil88
8 months ago#17
I see... thank you all for the info. Looks like I will be giving DmC:DE a shot after all.

User Info: Raeng

Raeng
8 months ago#18
rene48 posted...
Gonna have to disagree here. DmC definitely has more combo creativity than DMC 3, simply by the fact that you have access to everything. And it has the same amount of options as DMC 4. Also DmC is no slower than any of the other DMC games. At least DmC doesn't have that stupid mechanic where you have to build speed before you can run. And the enemies are no worse then the gimmicky bulls*** enemies in DMC 3 and 4
I can see that, though I do disagree. DMC3's moveset had a lot more 'application' to it in my eyes, if that makes any sense? Title felt a lot slower to me, attack speed alone though that could just be the way animations were keyed. I didn't play the game enough for a thorough mechanical analysis so I'll take your word for it.

Regarding enemies though, though they had gimmicks, at least DMC3's foes had something. DmC's foes were only identified by how you had to hurt them.
"Oh flying enemy"
"Oh teleporting enemy"
"Oh enemy with shield"
That was basically their enemy design.
http://www.stingermagazine.com - articles on the action genre's best.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC09UqeY80WzoWMnxRkL4Tkw - challenge runs.

User Info: Delta123456789

Delta123456789
8 months ago#19
Speaking of DmC enemies I remember quite liking the Witch enemies in that game, with how they could project a shield over themselves or another enemy and you could reflect their magic attacks back at them to break the barrier/kill them. It felt like a refreshingly different enemy behaviour even if I could see it being pretty annoying if implemented incorrectly. IIRC you could also break the barrier by dealing a lot of damage to it so you weren't completely forced to fight a particular way.

It was interesting to see a more support-type enemy in a DMC game.
If you're a success odds are darned good you got help, support and/or a few second chances along the way, so think long and hard before denying them to others.

User Info: rene48

rene48
8 months ago#20
Raeng posted...
I can see that, though I do disagree. DMC3's moveset had a lot more 'application' to it in my eyes, if that makes any sense?
In DmC i actually felt the weapons had a purpose. In DMC 3 i didn't see any reason to use anything beside the Rebellion.

Raeng posted...
Regarding enemies though, though they had gimmicks, at least DMC3's foes had something
If by something, you mean giving them armor so they can't be staggered or launched. Then yeah, i guess that is something.

"Hey lets sell this games on been able to style upon the enemies, and then give most of them armor so they can't be styled upon"
That's basically DMC 3 enemy design

Raeng posted...
I didn't play the game enough for a thorough mechanical analysis so I'll take your word for it
So you don't really understand DmCs mechanics, and yet you write it off as inferior to the other games in franchise. You sound like those mechanically blind casuals you and buddy's likes to make fun of on your forum.
Correct a fool and he will hate you; correct a wise man and he will appreciate you.
  1. Boards
  2. Devil May Cry 5
  3. What exactly was wrong with DmC's combat?
  • Topic Archived

GameFAQs Q&A