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  3. Strongest Smash Character In Canon - Day 57: Bowser Vs. Mewtwo

User Info: Shyy_Guy99

Shyy_Guy99
6 months ago#61
Doopliss_Power posted...
Tell me, exactly how quickly can Bowser make this vortex? And how does Me First and Aura Sphere not work within the canon of Pokemon? Many of Pokemon's mechanics are established as canon by the dialogue in the games. In comparison to other Pokemon, Mewtwo isn't a slowpoke, either. Mewtwo may not be able to spam his moves, but there are moves like Toxic that it'd only need to use once before camping with his teleportation (even if Bowser can also teleport, Mewtwo is smarter and should be able to evade) and various defensive abilities before just murdering him.


Bowser also has Poison Manipulation and has been in toxic environments before. Black holes emit tons of radiation and yet he and Mario are fine while fighting in one. Heck, his Metal form, going by Pokémon rules, would be more resistant to that.

And again, how do you propose he'd murder him? What does Mewtwo have that can effectively off Bowser?

User Info: Agabon

Agabon
6 months ago#62
Mewtwo may be able to erase people's minds and make them forget what they're doing, but how is he gonna be able to kill Bowser afterwards?
Not to mention Bowser recovered from his amnesia before in Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga.

And if he CANT for some reason, his natural aggression will make him fight Mewtwo again. Mewtwo is strong as heck, but no way can he kill Bowser. Dude fell into a friggin' black hole and we still see him to this day.

User Info: SirNightmayor

SirNightmayor
6 months ago#63
Shyy_Guy99 posted...
SirNightmayor posted...
Shyy_Guy99 posted...
Yes, because the one not making semse has posted evidence and explained in great detail their enitre argument while the opposition is practically rehashing the same, dull points with little explanation or evidence.

I'm clearly the oblivious one here.


You're explanations for how Bowser is capable of FTL feats are really reaching especially when you try to include stuff like positions on a battlefield grid from an RPG as explanations for how he has undodgeable attacks. Your defense of how he is capable of FTL feats is shallow at best and borderline fanboyism at worst. If his attacks are truly undodgeable then how come Mario can merely jump over his fire balls in the series. Heck in order to beat him in Mario Bros 3 you need to dodge all of his attacks in order to defeat him. In terms of intelligence it's no contest that Mewtwo has Bowser beat. Also if Bowser was so much faster than Mewtwo then why is he capable of being defeated by Toads in the New Super Mario Bros. Series as well as 3D World? If we want to use Smash as support as well even though this is a canon discussion then Mewtwo is clearly much faster than Bowser but that's counting Smash and we're not doing that here.

Bowser's feats in canon and out of canon (looking mainly at the spinoff games like the RPG series) are far too inconsistent. His size and durability as well as intelligence seem to change constantly from game to game it's ridiculous.


Mario can dodge them because he compares to Bowser in terms of stats. I was also trying to explain the fallacy of gameplay mechanics there.

And no, it's not fanboyism? What slow a** speed do you get from owning ships that carried a castle to the heart of the universe when multiple galaxies in the game are described as being at the "far reaches of space"? What do you get when a Comet Observatory that can traverse the universe at quick speeds is halted by Bowser in canon?

What speed do you get from flying next to objects that burst forth from a container in a star-less space and suddenly have it bloom to life with said objects as they return to their place in the universe? (MP9)

What do you get from being able to reach the Sun from Earth in a short timeframe when it takes light 8 minutes to reach Earth? (MP8)

Tell me how I'm exaggerating? How fast do you have to be in order to briefly outswim or fight back against black holes that literally warp space and the light behind them? (Few Mario Party games)

Tell me how quick something has to be in order to go from the center of the universe to the Earth from what looks to be deep space and eberyone in the swries can react to it? (Millennium Star MP3)

What speed do you believe Giant Luigi jumping out of the atmosphere and reaching deep space within a few seconds takes? How come Giant enemies like Bowser can fight him and Mario can react to being thrown from that part of space and down to the planet in around a minute at best?

Who can create a vortex with seemingly no objects giving him power that eats planets in MP9? Oh wait, Bowser? Who would've thought!


When you're using spinoff games like Mario Party to support your points that's when I know I can't take you seriously. Bowser stopping the Comet Observatory or taking Peach's Castle to the middle of the universe using his ships aren't a testament of his own speed. They're a testament of the speed of the vehicles he creates. For example just because I own a plane that can go faster than sound doesn't mean I can move faster than sound and react faster. It also was never stated how far the Mushroom Kingdom was from the heart of the universe and he could have used his black holes to get the castle there instantly.
Friend Code: 1865-3412-2338
Ingame Name for Pokemon Moon: Juan

User Info: Agabon

Agabon
6 months ago#64
SirNightmayor posted...
When you're using spinoff games like Mario Party to support your points that's when I know I can't take you seriously.

That's not a very fair argument. Most of Mewtwo's feats are from the anime and the mangas. Neither of them are main-line, just loosely based from the games.

User Info: Shyy_Guy99

Shyy_Guy99
6 months ago#65
The vehicles are a testament of his speed if he stops a vehicle that plows through them in the end canonically.

Also, Bowser never displayed the ability to create a vortex under his own power in Galaxy 1.

And Spin-Offs, whether you believe it or not, aren't non-canon. They haven't been specified as such and the rules do say we can use anything canon. If something isn't classified as non-canon, then what is it by default? You're smart. Fivure it out.

User Info: SirNightmayor

SirNightmayor
6 months ago#66
Agabon posted...
Mewtwo may be able to erase people's minds and make them forget what they're doing, but how is he gonna be able to kill Bowser afterwards?
Not to mention Bowser recovered from his amnesia before in Mario & Luigi: Superstar Saga.

And if he CANT for some reason, his natural aggression will make him fight Mewtwo again. Mewtwo is strong as heck, but no way can he kill Bowser. Dude fell into a friggin' black hole and we still see him to this day.


Mewtwo could potentially turn Bowser into a vegetable if he can't recover from amnesia. He could forget everything he knows as well. As for how he could dispose of Bowser well he has a giant spoon he creates from psychic energy in the manga. But seriously he could probably just use his telekinesis to tear Bowser's brain out of his skull or something to that effect.
Friend Code: 1865-3412-2338
Ingame Name for Pokemon Moon: Juan

User Info: Shyy_Guy99

Shyy_Guy99
6 months ago#67
Has he ever done so though? He's not displayed this level of skill with it. Can't assume things they've never done.

And again, still weaker and slower and susceptible to way more of Bowser's hax than Bowser is to his

User Info: ClarkyMalarky

ClarkyMalarky
6 months ago#68
If we're making this a canon fight based off of their feats in JUST the games and not media (the anime is ass in the first place and should be ignored)...

With no bfrs we can assume the following:

Mewtwo isn't limited to a 4 moveset and can use all of his natural moves (mind control is not one of them). For the sake of argument, we should exclude hm/tms since that adds unnecessary complexity (no mega evolution either).

We have:

-Confusion
-Laser Focus
-Psywave
-Safeguard
-Disable
-Psychic
-Swift
-Future sight
-Miracle Eye
-Psycho Cut
-Guard Swap
-Power Swap
-Recover
-Barrier
-Aura Sphere
-Amnesia
-Mist
-Me First
-Psy Strike

Now Bowser is a turtle dragon that breathes fire, has been different sizes, and many incarnations. If this were a normal Koopa fight, we could assume the following:

1. He'd be in his clown copter
2. He has some sort of gadgetry... f*** it...

Mewtwo wins. Unless we give Bowser some wand, star garbage, or power-up, he loses.

User Info: SirNightmayor

SirNightmayor
6 months ago#69
Shyy_Guy99 posted...
Has he ever done so though? He's not displayed this level of skill with it. Can't assume things they've never done.

And again, still weaker and slower and susceptible to way more of Bowser's hax than Bowser is to his


Even if he is incapable of vegetating Bowser, he would be capable of erasing his memory as well as replacing it with new ones as he did to Nurse Joy.

Would Bowser be capable of these speed feats without harnessing the power of the Grand Stars like he does in the Galaxy games?
Friend Code: 1865-3412-2338
Ingame Name for Pokemon Moon: Juan

User Info: not__shawn__z

not__shawn__z
6 months ago#70
NaberiusBuster posted...
I'm leaning Mewtwo because Bowser doesn't have any mind resistance feats and fell under the control of Cackletta during the events of Superstar Saga.


Oh damn. This is good. RIP Bowser
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