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User Info: Dark Symphony

Dark Symphony
4 weeks ago#21
Blue_Inigo posted...
We have interviews with Sakurai talking about how he only took three days off in December because he and his team had to work on DLC. We have interviews of him talking about how the modes added in the April update couldn't make it at launch because they still needed testing.

We know they're still actively working on the game


None of that means anything. What is going on here? How does this Groundhog Day mentality cultivate so strongly amongst video game fans? Deva lie. It's not a new thing. It's one thing to believe them. Nothing wrong with trust. However, "dev said so so true" is a position no one should have at this point.

User Info: Dragonage2ftw

Dragonage2ftw
4 weeks ago#22
I dunno if Sakurai held anything back.

I mean, Piranha Plant has a Guidance, but all that suggests is that it was being developed alongside the main game and wasn’t finished in time.
Official Yu Narukami, Incineroar, Parasoul, Sombra, Black Widow, RE5 Jill, Kaede Akamatsu, Kamala Khan, Rehgar, Orisa, R.Mika, 2B, and Power Girl everywhere.

User Info: Dark Symphony

Dark Symphony
4 weeks ago#23
All I'm saying is we don't know for sure and taking devs words when they have a vested interest in lying isn't the best consumer strategy.

In the current climate a lot rides on whether or not a dev is perceived to have held back content. That tells me they have incentive to lie. And many have. I try to judge post release content based exclusively on how it affects my experience without giving any sway to anything devs claim about their development process.

User Info: Fazeo13

Fazeo13
4 weeks ago#24
Still no walgui!? **** this game.
You aren't even really reading my posts; you're just staring at your e-mail client and fondly reminiscing about that hobo you stabbed to death. :P

User Info: Blue_Inigo

Blue_Inigo
4 weeks ago#25
Dark Symphony posted...
Blue_Inigo posted...
We have interviews with Sakurai talking about how he only took three days off in December because he and his team had to work on DLC. We have interviews of him talking about how the modes added in the April update couldn't make it at launch because they still needed testing.

We know they're still actively working on the game


None of that means anything. What is going on here? How does this Groundhog Day mentality cultivate so strongly amongst video game fans? Deva lie. It's not a new thing. It's one thing to believe them. Nothing wrong with trust. However, "dev said so so true" is a position no one should have at this point.

There's more proof going against your assumption. Your proof that Sakurai could be lying because...other people lie. That's a bit absurd. What reason would he have to make up a story about only taking three days off so that he could go back to work on content post release? It's plain as day Sakurai and his team put a gargantuan amount of effort in making the Smash games.

Saying he's lying without having any proof while we have interviews that identify how parts of the development went is beyond skeptical
"This is your last dance."
(edited 4 weeks ago)

User Info: Dark Symphony

Dark Symphony
4 weeks ago#26
Blue_Inigo posted...
Dark Symphony posted...
Blue_Inigo posted...
We have interviews with Sakurai talking about how he only took three days off in December because he and his team had to work on DLC. We have interviews of him talking about how the modes added in the April update couldn't make it at launch because they still needed testing.

We know they're still actively working on the game


None of that means anything. What is going on here? How does this Groundhog Day mentality cultivate so strongly amongst video game fans? Deva lie. It's not a new thing. It's one thing to believe them. Nothing wrong with trust. However, "dev said so so true" is a position no one should have at this point.

There's more proof going against your assumption. Your proof that Sakurai could be lying because...other people lie. That's a bit absurd. What reason would he have to make up a story about only taking three days off so that he could go back to work on content post release? It's plain as day Sakurai and his team put a gargantuan amount of effort in making the Smash games.

Saying he's lying without having any proof while we have interviews that identify how parts of the development went is beyond skeptical


There's nothing logical about what you just said.

You. Don't. Know. You're guessing. You've given reasons for your opinion and why you believe him. Great. Nothing wrong with that. Your comprehension failed you when you concluded I didn't believe him. There is no evidence going against my assumption because my assumption is that you don't know for sure and you have admitted that. I don't know for sure. I admit that.

The reality that people lie is a very potent reason for entertaining the possibility.

You're not silly for believing him. Not knowing what it means to not know something for sure is silly. Concluding that someone isn't lying because someone else lying doesn't mean they're lying is a silly conclusion and a silly reason to believe someone. "They told me" is a silly evidential standard. Insinuating that there's a default onus on people to trust what people say is a silly thing to do.

User Info: Blue_Inigo

Blue_Inigo
4 weeks ago#27
No, I do know they're still working on the game. It's not a guess when you have proof. Patches that balance the game do not come out of nowhere nor do new game modes or characters.

Your logic is straight up idiotic. If you do believe him why come up with your baseless contrarian assumptions? For the sake of being contrarian? Stop being disingenuous with your posts
"This is your last dance."

User Info: Dark Symphony

Dark Symphony
4 weeks ago#28
Blue_Inigo posted...
No, I do know they're still working on the game. It's not a guess when you have proof. Patches that balance the game do not come out of nowhere nor do new game modes or characters.


Well, I'm only talking about characters despite your intentionally dishonest attempts to broaden the scope so as to make your point stick (it's not working). Even considering the other parts, it's actually possible to schedule updates so as to make those things come "out of nowhere." We've seen it done before. SFxT both had schedules updates that were created during the initial development and then held back as well as dynamic updates that happened post release. That shows that both are possible even though SFxT met the same exact standards of "proof" that you have posted here.

Your "proof" that they're still working on characters is developer interviews which isn't proof. Just faith. Which is fine. I'm not confronting a person's right to believe someone. You think their words are plausible. 100% fine. Reasonable even. Not proof but reasonable.

I guess you could really stretch things to super obtuse fashions (which wouldn't surprise me) by saying that someone actually uploading the characters onto the server counts as "still working on characters" but we know that's not what's at hand in the discussion.

Blue_Inigo posted...
No, I do know they're still working on the game. It's not a guess when you have proof. Patches that balance the game do not come out of nowhere nor do new game modes or characters.


Well, I'm only talking about characters despite your intentionally dishonest attempts to broaden the scope so as to make your point stick (it's not working). Even considering the other parts, it's actually possible to schedule updates so as to make those things come "out of nowhere." We've seen it done before. SFxT both had schedules updates that were created during the initial development and then held back as well as dynamic updates that happened post release. That shows that both are possible even though SFxT met the same exact standards of "proof" that you have posted here.

Your "proof" that they're still working on characters is developer interviews which isn't proof. Just faith. Which is fine. I'm not confronting a person's right to believe someone. You think their words are plausible. 100% fine. Reasonable even. Not proof but reasonable.

I guess you could really stretch things to super obtuse fashions (which wouldn't surprise me) by saying that someone actually uploading the characters onto the server counts as "still working on characters" but we know that's not what's at hand in the discussion.

Blue_Inigo posted...
Your logic is straight up idiotic.


No it's not. You just posted that because my post made you upset. It's actually quite sound: taking someone's word for something isn't proof and continuous updates/releases of characters is not hands-down proof that the dev team is still working on them based on empirical evidence.

User Info: Dark Symphony

Dark Symphony
4 weeks ago#29
Blue_Inigo posted...
If you do believe him why come up with your baseless contrarian assumptions?


You can't be asking this question while already having condemned my logic. You should figure this out first because it's required for you to properly assess my logic.

Your "logic," however, isn't holding up.

1: I didn't say I believed him. I didn't say I didn't believe him. I actually don't have to do either. I don't have enough info to go off. I'm not going to grant them default good will and trust because that's been proven to be consumer folly when dealing with this industry. It's actually possible to not have a position on someone's credibility in either direction.

2: The only thing I could have assumed in this topic is that you don't know what's actually going on in the Smash Brothers dev studio. You've yet to say you've been there and seen things first hand so that assumption seems spot on. You keep interpreting "you don't know" for "that's not true." Quit doing that. You believe what Sakurai says. You don't know for sure but you believe. You think they're still working on these characters, developing them post release based on what you've seen. Me saying you don't know for sure only says one thing: that you don't know for sure. It's not a commentary on what they're doing at the dev studio.

Blue_Inigo posted...
For the sake of being contrarian?


Saying "you don't know" isn't being a contrarian. I don't think you know what a contrarian is. It's not someone who says something different than you.

Blue_Inigo posted...
Stop being disingenuous with your posts


I've been the most... genuous. You've been actively dishonest with the usual spin-doctoring and subject broadening gambits. You don't know how any of the post release content is handled or when it's actually being developed. You believe what Sakurai says. You don't "lose" somehow because you are revealed to be relying on trust. You DO lose when you start substituting faith and circumstance for proof.

Me? I'd trust that things like bug fix patches and balance patches are developed dynamically post release. Characters I never trust are developed when developers say because there's too much riding on being dishonest in this current consumer culture war between devs and gamers. I choose to just look at what they're releasing and judge it based entirely on what's in front of me and when and pay no heed to what devs try to sell me as far as what they've done and when.

User Info: Pitaya

Pitaya
4 weeks ago#30
Dark Symphony posted...
You heard it here, fellas. People don't read.

You don't know how and when thesw characters are being developed.

You're on some Alex Jones-tier conspiracy nonsense if you actually think there aren't people working on the characters. Of course there are people working on the characters.

You take the "burden of proof" thing way too far sometimes, and for no real reason either. Like, what even is your argument here?
I solemnly swear that I aim to misbehave.
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