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  3. As much as I love Edelgard, I have to admit it: she's wrong.

User Info: SC6

SC6
2 days ago#261
Tenzen12 posted...
SC6 posted...
Vayu_The_End posted...
As I've stated before, it only got to that point because the Empire lost the war. The Church just helped negotiate terms for peace.

Church needs considerable amount of influence to do this though
and not just be a passive bystander some people like to claim

Rhea's influence and authority gets down played way too much.

If the Church has minor influence, Lonato's rebellion should've been a Kingdom affair. The Church would've asked Dimitri and Rodrigue to deal with it and just focus on the Western Church.

But they sent their own military in without needing to consult the Crown Prince or the King Regent.


I think it's pretty self-evident, proper authorities were contacted. I mean sure we don't have any hard proof, but that should be common sense. I am also pretty sure that Kingdom nobility find preferable not waste own resources to clean church mess if they can help it.


That’s not what you do when you want to be recognized as an independent power.

Common sense would suggest Church Is highly influential and the Kingdom will just say yes. Because they’re closely tied allies.

Which circles back to how difficult diplomacy would be for someone in the Empire.

The church would also like to remind the kingdom, Empire, and Alliance that while they’re at peace, they were once enemies and fought each other.
PSN - NovaSol6(PS3/VITA), GreenTea_Sama(PS4)
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User Info: SC6

SC6
2 days ago#262
The Church only has this much influence there. In the Empire, their influence is near nonexistent and in the alliance, it varies depending on what house in the Alliance you are talking about.


Agree
PSN - NovaSol6(PS3/VITA), GreenTea_Sama(PS4)
3DS FC: 0533-5134-4439

User Info: JulieWx

JulieWx
2 days ago#263
Not here to debate, just wanna applaud you TC about having an open mind.

I think it's fine to like a morally gray character who is interesting and flawed. At least you did not have blinders on about what she did and then proceed to bash everyone in the story who didn't conform to her good intention but morally questionable plans.
(edited 2 days ago)

User Info: Loyreid

Loyreid
2 days ago#264
Evil Is always the loser it's the victor who has justice on their side

User Info: BSkullClad

BSkullClad
2 days ago#265
sylawaatch posted...
Esper69 posted...
Hahahhaa no. Evidence sugest otherwise. They nuke the world first sothis had to clean up their mess. But i guess a word of a pitch black organization is more credible than dragons huh?
No they built the nukes and Sothis attacked them before they even used them.

False. They used the nukes first.
https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/253573-mortal-kombat-11/77796150 - Let's redo MK11's story how it should be!

User Info: Omega203

Omega203
2 days ago#266
SC6 posted...
It's also in his profile in game. Besides, if Felix calls him that in the academy. Everyone will hear it.
But we're talking about pre academy, so we can ignore that. But I'm pretty sure Kingdom suppressing the rebellion with an army led by Dimitri is recorded in the library and can be inferred to be common knowledge

Yes, he led troops in a battle about 2 years afters the incident at Duscur (age approximately 14). As I've said, we don't know the truth of what happened in that battle, and Felix is rude to everyone. Furthermore, after the timeskip Felix talks about how Dimitri is like a totally different person. In short, you can't take everything Felix says as 100% gospel.

Domitri also catches Flame Emperor threatening to end Thales if they try Remire again. Just as easy to interpret that Flame Emperor is against taking civilian lives. After all, Remire is even the Church's territory.

It could mean any number of things. It could just mean that the flame emperor is mad that activities made such a stir and drew attention to their group. Additionally, threatening to end allies that disappoint you is indeed something that evil people do. However, it is clear that even after those events the flame emperor is continuing to work with the evil people. If the flame emperor had actually cut ties with Thales in that scene, THAT would have been meaningful action. And if you say she couldn't, then the supposed threat you mention is nothing more than empty words. I'm not sure what Remire being in "church territory" even means. I didn't know which of the three territories it belonged to, and I didn't know the church had any territory, other than Garreg Mach. More to the point, it doesn't seem that significant where the event took place. The meeting with Monica, Thales, and flame emperor certainly appears to be a group of evil people, and it appears that the flame emperor is the one in charge. It is leap of logic, but it is a reasonable one, that is more likely than the other options, given the information that he (not the player who has played other routes) knows.SC6 posted...
I'm pretty sure Thales declared wanting to overthrow the church.

Not that I'm aware of, not in front of the professor of Blue Lions. What is the timeframe on that?

You have to get everyone to believe the Crests are not a gift from the goddess and not important at all.

War is not at all a great method for that. And most of the time, she loses, so it's far from being without risk.

Dimitri gave this whole shpeal to Byleth that it's the same knife he gave to Edelgard when they're kids. He's confident it's the same knife.

He's more sure about Flame Emperor being Edelgard than Edelgard orchestrating a royal assassination.
If we're acting based on definitive proof, he's still jumping the gun pinning Duscar on her.

I don't remember exact quote so I could be wrong. If Thales owned up to Duscar, then I take all this back lol

Still hilarious that it's painfully obvious Edelgard is the Flame Emperor in BL route but no one says or does anything.

He recognizes the dagger, but to say that means Edelgard is the flame emperor is definitely a leap of logic. As I mentioned before, he is in denial that is it is her, because from what he and the professor have seen, the flame emperor is clearly evil.
(edited 2 days ago)

User Info: Omega203

Omega203
2 days ago#267
SC6 posted...
Questionable. Still a crowned prince needing to handle internal affair.

Fine, you can question everything that is stated in the game if it doesn't fit your narratvie. He is not crowned at that point in time. You even mentioned earlier that Rodrigue is the acting king.

User Info: Omega203

Omega203
2 days ago#268
SC6 posted...
I'm still irked by lack of trial and investigation.

There was a "trial", which was rather shoddy indeed. The lack of questioning of those rebels is indeed one of the most questionable activities of the church throughout part 1 of the Blue Lion route.

User Info: Esper69

Esper69
2 days ago#269
SC6 posted...
Lonato wasn't actively attacking the church. Nor did he raise an actual army.
No one else is voicing disproval.
Lonato is already on his way to kill rhea lmao. His battle dialogue confirms it.

User Info: Esper69

Esper69
2 days ago#270
Airship_Canon posted...
False.

Because anything besides starting a war will not do anything? Also, exposing the truth gets you branded a heretic and your head lopped off. Rhea's extremely execution happy. Reminder of what happens on Chapter 3 and 4.

Literally control the continent with an iron fist, and execute at the first sign of dissent. Sure she lets non-believers hang around, but question her-or her authority and the knights are coming for your head.

What happened to Sothis was literally Retaliation for genocide-- why the f*** would a nation that has nuclear weapons need dragon swords and magical balls of hit twice if they're at their full might? No, the Dragons struck first-- the information from the Golden Deer route comes from her. It's not trustworthy at all.

She exalted the crests, creating a power structure entirely centered around them. The crests themselves are hardly an issue, and yeah, they wouldn't care- but she made them care by causing the system to be created.

Not to mention her human experimentation and s***. Edel route ending proves she lies about why Byleth had the Crest of Flames. There's nothing trustworthy about her at all.

Lonato wasn't- the scenes with Ashe on BL prove that no, the Knights were moving first. His only crime was speaking out against her power structure-- which ultimately cements that yes, it takes a war to topple the Regime.
This is literal joke lmao. "retaliation for genocide?" this guy is one of those guys who thinks trusting arundel word is a good thing. So imma tell you eats really going on. Sothis comes and built a civilization (agarthans) with a teaching mainly fostering peace. Technological breakthrough and stuff, agarthans starts to think themself as god and say "f*** sothis's teachinf, lets conquer the world using our tech" and starts a warmongering way of life. Nukes are destroying world left and right risking an apocalypse. In order to stop this mess sothis starts to "enough is enough" and drove them from the land and retreat to the ground then revive the land. So no. You dont get to say its a retaliation of genocide. You're just full of s*** if you think arundel is more trustworthy than rhea or just being racist to dragon/human supremacist.
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