So umm....what are considered the good SMT games again?

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  3. So umm....what are considered the good SMT games again?

User Info: Kantiran

Kantiran
4 months ago#1
I heard a lot of positives about Strange Journey (which wasn't released in europe so I couldn't play it). But on this forum it sounds weirdly bad? I am a casual SMT fan (having played the Digital Devil Saga games, the Devil Survivor games, the IV games and parts of Nocturne, I'm stuck at a boss there).
The weird thing is that....are there games that "true fans" consider good aside from Nocturne, Devil Survivor 1 and MAYBE Devil Survivor 2 and the Digital Devil Saga games? And is Strange Journey considered one of the more okay-ish ones or one of the more bad games?
Me confused...

User Info: Illuminoius

Illuminoius
4 months ago#2
i think nocturne and the two devil survivors are the games every can consider good (though ds2 has really bad writing
4 is a lesser apocolypse with apocolypse having the best battle system so far but smirking is pretty dumb and the writing is horrible and the game reuses a bit too much

strange journey:
-feels super lifeless in presentation with repetitive visuals and sound
-none of the improvements from apocolypse (besides sorting skills and demons telling you what they're changing skills into) were added
-dungeon design is bad, and the new dungeon isn't any better
-coop attacks limit your party since they deal far more damage than anything else for a huge portion of the game
-physical attacks don't benefit from the coop system at all outside of gun weaknesses (phys weaknesses are so rare) and the supapp that lets criticals activate coop attacks doesn't exist in the original and should have been an inherent part of the game
-coop system makes stats relatively meaningless. the only things that matter about demons are elemental resistances and alignment, since even a demon with a crappy magic stat can greatly benefit from coop attacks
-story is pretty awful
-is actually very easy, with generic encounters being almost entirely a joke and bosses varying from being a complete joke to being unfair and rng (the port gets rid of the rng, making most bosses except for the final bosses a joke)
-skill inheritance is not properly explained and fusion is mostly done with manipulation of demon sources which are rng by themselves

it's a 5/10 or 6/10 at best since demon fusion is inherently satisfying but the game is too easy and simple and the dungeon design is very weak

User Info: matteste

matteste
4 months ago#3
That depends, there are the modern fans and the more oldschool fans. As such, it can vary a bit. Among the modern fans, it seems to be mostly as you said (Nocturne, DDS, DDS2 and DS1). Though from what I gather, King Abaddon, Persona 3 and occasionally Strange Journey as well sometimes makes into that category. Among the more oldschool crowd, games such as Soul Hackers and Persona 2 tend to be standouts and SMT II for the really hardcore ones.

But as a general rule, it seems that Nocturne is kinda like the Ocarina of Time in the SMT fandom, the one that all other games are judged against.

(But as Illuminoius mentioned, DS2 and IV tend to be divisive while IVA range from divisive to outright hated depending on where you ask.)
The worst readers are those who proceed like plundering soldiers: they pick up a few things they can use, soil and confuse the rest, and blaspheme the whole.
(edited 4 months ago)

User Info: Salocool

Salocool
4 months ago#4
I entirely agree with both Illuminoius and Matteste's post.

Let me go on a tangent regarding Apocalypse : while it certainly had the best battle system to boot (minus the smirk bulls***), it still pales against Nocturne because of : (a) No stakes during random battles as you get resurrected (b) Flat pictures are still nowhere as involving as the 3D models of Nocturne or Etrian Odyssey 4+ (c) The battle themes are nowhere close to Meguro or Koshiro's level (d) It emulates Nocturne and DDS way too much, leaving little to no room for genuine surprise or new strategy (Kaja, Kunda, Hit Weakness, repeat). Only a very small amount of Bosses were designed with novelty in mind, making them the only fun part of this over-bloated title.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
(edited 4 months ago)

User Info: mastermix3000

mastermix3000
4 months ago#5
Kantiran posted...
are there games that "true fans" consider good aside from Nocturne, Devil Survivor 1 and MAYBE Devil Survivor 2 and the Digital Devil Saga games?


Yea but those games are really good when compared to the others

I'd actually place Persona 5 in there too, it definitely deserves it
RIP in peace Junpei 6/1/17 :(

User Info: Salocool

Salocool
4 months ago#6
mastermix3000 posted...
I'd actually place Persona 5 in there too, it definitely deserves it

For some people like me, the school sim is completely unbearable tho. Still wouldn't deny it's easily the best Persona game Atlus has devised so far in terms of presentation and gameplay.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.

User Info: Kantiran

Kantiran
4 months ago#7
Illuminoius posted...
i think nocturne and the two devil survivors are the games every can consider good (though ds2 has really bad writing
4 is a lesser apocolypse with apocolypse having the best battle system so far but smirking is pretty dumb and the writing is horrible and the game reuses a bit too much

strange journey:
-feels super lifeless in presentation with repetitive visuals and sound
-none of the improvements from apocolypse (besides sorting skills and demons telling you what they're changing skills into) were added
-dungeon design is bad, and the new dungeon isn't any better
-coop attacks limit your party since they deal far more damage than anything else for a huge portion of the game.
-physical attacks don't benefit from the coop system at all outside of gun weaknesses (phys weaknesses are so rare) and the supapp that lets criticals activate coop attacks doesn't exist in the original and should have been an inherent part of the game
-coop system makes stats relatively meaningless. the only things that matter about demons are elemental resistances and alignment, since even a demon with a crappy magic stat can greatly benefit from coop attacks
-story is pretty awful
-is actually very easy, with generic encounters being almost entirely a joke and bosses varying from being a complete joke to being unfair and rng (the port gets rid of the rng, making most bosses except for the final bosses a joke)
-skill inheritance is not properly explained and fusion is mostly done with manipulation of demon sources which are rng by themselves

it's a 5/10 or 6/10 at best since demon fusion is inherently satisfying but the game is too easy and simple and the dungeon design is very weak

Weird. I always hear that it's supposed to be so good and I have seen not many but some people who say strange journey is their favourite JRPG. I'll still try it. I wonder where I will fall.

Also generally out of interest: What was before Nocturne? Are SMT 1 and 2 SUPER outdated or something?

User Info: Salocool

Salocool
4 months ago#8
Kantiran posted...
Are SMT 1 and 2 SUPER outdated or something?

Hell yeah, the only aspects that still work are the assets (art, music and such); the gameplay is atrociously repetitive, cumbersome and uneventful.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.

User Info: matteste

matteste
4 months ago#9
Salocool posted...
mastermix3000 posted...
I'd actually place Persona 5 in there too, it definitely deserves it

For some people like me, the school sim is completely unbearable tho. Still wouldn't deny it's easily the best Persona game Atlus has devised so far in terms of presentation and gameplay.

True, though it suffer from the same issue as IVA. And absolute mess of a story.
The worst readers are those who proceed like plundering soldiers: they pick up a few things they can use, soil and confuse the rest, and blaspheme the whole.

User Info: Salocool

Salocool
4 months ago#10
matteste posted...
True, though it suffer from the same issue as IVA. And absolute mess of a story.

Atlus and Intelligent Systems seems to both have incredible difficulty hiring anything close to competent writers for the best part of the last decade.
And the Lord [...] drive out the inhabitants of the mountain; but could not drive out the inhabitants of the valley, because they had chariots of iron.
(edited 4 months ago)
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