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  3. Honestly can someone please tell me what the forced agenda is in this game?

User Info: pwiggler

pwiggler
1 week ago#51
Mr_Grumbles posted...
Father figures are bad.

really men in general

also constantly forcing a sexuality down your throat.
#nogeno#nochief#nosteve#nowah#nocrash#nospyro
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User Info: eloepp

eloepp
1 week ago#52
I haven’t played it but my cousin who is playing it says there’s many races represented and LGBT. I don’t know about this “agenda” business people are so hung up on, but developers of anything shouldn’t feel like like they have to appeal to everybody. It’s silly and unrealistic for everything to be that way. We have this kind of culture now where freedom is really being taken away in a sense. I say all this bearing no ill will/discrimination/prejudice towards anyone... I have direct family that is LGBT and mix race.

User Info: Zantar_16

Zantar_16
1 week ago#53
BurningVigor posted...
Wow look at how strong women are. So independent and capable. Look Abby so big and strong not like the typical women. She can take on several men all at once. Pregnant women are strong too don't look down on them. They are brave and beautiful.

Look at all the men who die. Women should be the only ones who live. Men are toxic and dumb.

This whole game is like rawr I'm not a conventional female. Women can be men too but better. It's the same thing like the Star Wars, ghost busters, terminator, etc etc. It's a narrative that's been constantly preached down your throat.

We've already been aware of this since Tomb Raider. Did Tomb Raider have the same kind of reception?

I think the forced agenda being pushed is more of the 'Bieng gay is a good thing!' and also 'Here's lots of sex scenes!'...

User Info: TheOtherMike

TheOtherMike
1 week ago#54
Zantar_16 posted...
I think the forced agenda being pushed is more of the 'Bieng gay is a good thing!'

Nowhere does the game say or suggest this though. Being gay isn't portrayed as good or bad, it's just portrayed as existing.

User Info: hisroyalbonkess

hisroyalbonkess
1 week ago#55
Makino_Yushiro posted...
I felt the game was really just going off a checklist of different people to include without really putting much thought into it and it doesn't contribute to the story or characters overall. I had no problem with Ellie being a lesbian, that was already established previously. But her relationship with Dina was so shallow and lacked any kind of depth. I would've loved to see their relationship deepen and have some bonding moments but we never got that and that in turn made me not care for Dina at all.

They also didn't really think through the message they were trying to convey with Lev's identity. They used his identity as a plot device all just to include a trans character and to say being trans is ok. But let's not forget, his actions led to his sister suffering and losing her arm and eventually her life and also led to the accidental death of their mother. Not exactly the best representation for trans people when coming out as trans gets your entire family killed.

Inclusion of people of different identities and orientations are fine but it needs to be done with better care and works in the context of the overall story. Just shoehorning it in for just the sake of inclusion ruins the story.

Did you go out of your way to converse with Dina? I felt the same way for a bit but it's clear her and Ellie have a history.

Isaac's crew would have probably wiped out the island regardless of what Lev did. Yes, he went back because he loves his mom and thought explaining things calmly would work, but it didn't. In the context of this story, trans people (Lev) aren't painted in any bad light, because you have to consider the in-universe factors. It's just a character making a mistake. I cannot for the life of me see how Lev being trans is shoehorning. I see no sufficient evidence for it.
"It's hero time!"
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User Info: hisroyalbonkess

hisroyalbonkess
1 week ago#56
Reise posted...
Posted this already, but white men in particular are treated very poorly. Joel is mercilessly tortured and killed in front of his adoptive daughter after saving his killer's life. He's called a, "stupid old man", shot, tortured, killed, spit on and cursed, then later called a "little b****" who deserved it all. In general men are talked down to by the women and are consistently referred to as idiots, or useless, while the religious folks are referred to as "freaks."

Overall it seems the game creator's understanding of feminism is not to just portray women as these hulk-like badasses but to compound their power by simultaneously s***ting all over men. After all, both sexes can't be strong and worthwhile at the same time right? That would be "equality" or something. The old saying "some people try to be tall by cutting off the heads of others" applies here, I think.

It's also worth noting that abusive, manipulative people go to great lengths to justify their poor treatment of their victims. In other words, they convince those around them their victims deserve everything they get. The opening of the game could be interpreted in this light as a horrific abuse of the first game's main character then a 25 hour exercise in demonstrating why he deserved it, which is something sociopaths, narcissists, and psychopaths do. Joel deserved a lot better.

You had one example and then used that as a generalization... Please at least try to troll.

Joel is a stupid old man. We even get that perspective of him at the end of the first game.

Religious folks? You mean the literal death cult.

It sounds like you have some personal hangups with keyboard warriors that you're honestly spending too much energy on. Your last two paragraphs are irrelevant, and you've still posted no evidence that men, generally speaking, are belittled in TLoU.
"It's hero time!"
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User Info: Vibi

Vibi
1 week ago#57
Blackstar110 posted...
As evidenced by these fine young gentlemen, most of the complaints of an “agenda” are unhinged ramblings from professional victims who think everything is a crusade against the persecuted straight white male. Wouldn’t worry about it.
Like seriously. They see Joel’s death and say, “Yup. This is SJW propaganda! No way Joel would die to a woman! It would’ve been fine if a dude killed him though”.

They’re really only proving that the game had no agenda, with how their making one up themselves. I guess the first game was pushing and agenda just by having 2 prominent black males, huh?
Make your life better by listening to this: https://youtu.be/IcseamG7ReY

User Info: Zareth

Zareth
1 week ago#58
No agenda, just bad storytelling in a pointless sequel.
Oh, and whitewashing Abby's dad apparently.
It's okay, I have no idea who I am either.
http://i.imgur.com/WOo6wcq.png

User Info: Mr_Grumbles

Mr_Grumbles
1 week ago#59
hisroyalbonkess posted...
You had one example and then used that as a generalization... Please at least try to troll.

Joel is a stupid old man. We even get that perspective of him at the end of the first game.

Religious folks? You mean the literal death cult.

It sounds like you have some personal hangups with keyboard warriors that you're honestly spending too much energy on. Your last two paragraphs are irrelevant, and you've still posted no evidence that men, generally speaking, are belittled in TLoU.

The game kills off every male character in the game with little to no fanfare except Tommy. He at least gets to be a bitter cripple who is then turned into a bad guy by guilt tripping Ellie in an almost comically obvious heel turn.

Honestly if wasn't for that and how callously Jesse (he's basically just around to provide baby batter) gets treated I'd agree that its just the usual people being sensitive but when the only characters left being shown any thought are women its a pretty obvious bias.

User Info: Blackstar110

Blackstar110
1 week ago#60
Mr_Grumbles posted...
turned into a bad guy by guilt tripping Ellie in an almost comically obvious heel turn.
I don't think Tommy is turned into a bad guy. I sympathized with him entirely, even though he was in the wrong for guilting her. Doesn't mean I really blame him -- he went to kill Abby for her, to save her from the danger of doing it herself, and in the end got crippled and lost an eye and now she's like "nah I'm good." I get his resentment. I also think he'd come around.
-Shred
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