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  3. Rate of Fire Rifle Question

User Info: ChaoTime

ChaoTime
6 months ago#1
I just finished day 4 and got this really nice single fire rifle a little bit ago. I’d been putting offense and all my good stats on a rifle that had rate of fire x2 until this point. I like 2 shots on a rifle to be honest. 3+ is too many to be useful. But holy heck does this thing put out damage with 1. It’s the same statwise (44 Attack) as my 2x Rate of Fire rifle and for that I feel the need to ask:

Which do you think is better? 1x or 2x rate of Fire on a rifle and why? I’ve just become so used to 2x and I’ve been trying to compare. Should I dump a 2xRoF with a tool into this 1xRoF rifle I got? What’s optimal for rifles?

User Info: GoukiAkujiki

GoukiAkujiki
6 months ago#2
Two is good for a rifle until you get the multi action effects.

User Info: Raycon

Raycon
6 months ago#3
I think I read somewhere that highest total damage output is at 3xRoF (less damage per bullet but highest total damage). Downside is it, that leaves you standing in place longer, and on a rifle, that's just painful. The recoil time between each shot is just asking for punishment. As suggested, 2 is a pretty safe number for now. But you might want to consider moving up to a pistol or machine gun later on (which both have much faster rates of fire).

I was committed to my SG550 for the longest time before I heard people rave about the machine gun rate of fire. So I finally caved and gave it a try. My god, it goes through turns so fast...

Game is totally doable with a rifle though, don't get me wrong.
I must have looked a fool playing with a backwards DS, teary eyed solving a Sudoku puzzle -Lordx718

User Info: Perin Valin

Perin Valin
6 months ago#4
The damage bonus is highest for X10. You have to have very high base attack power compared to enemy defenses in order to see this. It's easy enough to test, so I don't know why this myth is so persistent.

x0, 84, 84, 100%
x2, 53, 106, 126%
x3, 37, 111, 132%
x5, 23, 115, 137%
x7, 17, 119, 142%
x10, 12, 120, 143%

The higher your power and the weaker the target the closer the damage per shot will be to the true amount.

The biggest factor is time. It's all about balancing your build against the circumstances.

I wouldn't recommend using X effects on a rifle, save the slots for things like Burst and Double Action. Rifles are slow, and with Effects like Burst, Tranquilizer, First, Double Action, Acid, ... you can make great use of your time, choose your targets, and take evasive action.

I actually recommend the SG550 to most new players in a fresh game, you can expand it up to five slots and it is meager points less than the G3A3. Effectively collecting PLUS stats easily offsets the difference, and the extra slot can easily incorporate X2 for extra damage if you are so inclined.

The ability to accrue BP is more important than anything else, and you need to avoid taking hits to get the most BP from each battle; a long range weapon that disables enemies is your best bet, both for dealing damage to multiple targets and evading hits. Once you feel comfortable with short range, or you have enough PLUS range stocked up, a machinegun is the best weapon, no contest. But a Rifle is probably number 2, and the best tactical choice may be to stay out of harm's way as much as possible.

Handguns are a solid compromise if you don't want to go too far in either direction. I view them more as "undecided" guns, but you can do well enough with Grenade Launchers and Shotguns, so, why not Handguns?

To summarize, it doesn't really matter what you do, as long as you don't overload X effects on weak or slow weapons, and your PLUS parameters are growing steadily. Those PLUS parameters are far more important than any base weapon or collection of weapon effects.

User Info: HegemonKhan

HegemonKhan
6 months ago#5
if I remember right... (it's been awhile)

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as you progress through the game, you find better equipment (obviously): weapons have higher base/starting damage and armors have higher base/starting defenses

however, the "junk" weapons from wayne (enabled on day 4, but not before), have the highest base/starting stats, so if you want to "cheat" get the desired "junk" weapon of your choice from wayne on day 4

( as can be seen by this source: https://parasiteeve.fandom.com/wiki/Parasite_Eve_Weapons )

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all weapons/armors have the same max stats, which require the 'plus' stats from BPs and/or tool using transference of the extra plus stats from equipment to equipment to reach those max stats

obviously, using an equipment with higher base/starting stats is better, as you already do more damage/defense, and also you need less PLUS stats to reach the max stats, but otherwise a weapon with less base/starting stats will still be the same as one with more base/starting stats in the end, as the max stats are the same for both

also important:

equipment (weapons and armors) usually have a base/starting amount of slots, but their max slots is greater (have to use tools, I think, to increase your equipment's slots)

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as to the best weapon, it's about:

speed and max slots

machine guns are #1 in speed
handguns are the #2 in speed

the P90 ("junk" weapon from wayne) is the best weapon in the game, as it is: a machine gun (fastest), has high starting/base stats (being a "junk" weapon), and has 7 max slots (I don't think there's a machine gun with more than 7 max slots... if there is, then the P90 isn't the best end game weapon)

if you aren't going to use the "junk" weapons, than arguably the next best weapon is the M92F (automatically given to you by wayne on the 3rd day), though it is a handgun (just slightly slower than machine guns) and it has low starting/base stats, however, it has 10 max slots, which makes it the best end game handgun

if you want the 3rd best weapon, you can get the DE50AE7 handgun (slightly slower than machine guns) from wayne's "junk" weapons (4th day), which has higher starting/base stats (being a "junk" weapon) than the M92F handgun given to you from wayne on the 3rd day, but it only has 9 max slots, compared to the M92F handgun with 10 max slots

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as to about best armor, since all armors have the same max stats, it comes down to one thing: max slots

so...

the best armor (cr armor 2: 10 max slots) is in the chrysler building and at very high floor level (near the end of the chrysler building)

but the 2nd best armor is tied/debatable amongst like 5 different armors, due to their differing starting/base 3 types of defenses, but end game wise, there's no difference amongst them, aside from possibly different max slots, but then you'll get the best armor (cr armor 2: 10 max slots) within the chrysler building, anyways

see this link on the five tied 2nd best armors: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/198265-parasite-eve/60803227

User Info: HegemonKhan

HegemonKhan
6 months ago#6
once you don't care about getting BPs (maxed out equipment stats and/or your desired character's stats/levels) (or just don't care about getting extra BPs from battle, which are insignificant compared to the BPs you get from completing days in the ex game) and are able to survive taking damage, the 'counter' ability means you do more damage (as you attack every time you get hit: think of it as extra attacks for yourself from intentionally letting yourself get hit)

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if you really want to power game, have multiple P90 machine gun weapons, that you switch between based on monsters/bosses:

P90 machine gun (7 max slots)

(1) Triple, (2) 10 RoF, (3) 1.5 All (ext spread) or 1.5 Half (spread), (4) 1st Stike, (5) Critical, (6) Counter/Retaliate, and (7) Tranquilizer/Acid/Cyanide (if no negatives)

1. P90 with (7) none (if acid/tranquilizer/cyanide have negatives)
2. P90 with (7) heat/explosive
3. P90 with (7) frost/freeze
4. P90 with (7) tranquilizer
5. P90 with (7) cyanide
6. P90 with (7) acid

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Cr armor 2 (10 max slots):

(1) PE Light, (2) Attack Up, (3) HP Max, (4) Auto Heal, (5) Auto Antedote, (6) Anti-Poison, (7) Anti-Confusion, (8) Anti-Darkness, (9) Anti-Paralyze, and (10) +4 Inventory

User Info: Perin Valin

Perin Valin
6 months ago#7
In general there are not enough Effects to justify any Handgun because the only superior quality they have is "more average slots", too many effects have poor generalizability, they have conditional benefits or outright negative consequences.

The most important effect class is Double / Triple Action; Triple Action is the single most useful effect, offering three actions per turn, and Double is second. Always a priority choice, no negative considerations.

The second most important is Random / Burst / Shoot-All; you can only have one of the three.
Burst increases damage by multiplying it by the number of targets in the area of effect, only limited by angle from the primary target, distance from Aya, and the range of the weapon. A long range weapon has a much larger effective area. There are no negatives.
Shoot-All multiplies damage by automatically assigning a full set of shots to every available target. An X2 weapon would fire 2 shots at every target, you risk wasting AT executing a large number of shots, especially with Double / Triple.
Random increases damage by adding 50% (rounded down) of the shots. An X2 weapon will assign 3 shots, an X10 weapon will assign 15. X3 weapons actually deal less damage than X2 weapons if combined with Random because of the rounding. Shot assignment is random, so you lose control, and, enemies that had shots assigned to them can die before the shots are fired, and they will not be re-assigned, just like when you manually choose your targets. Increases overall damage output, but it's hard to overcome the negatives.

X effects are the third most important. Misnamed Rate of Fire, this class adjusts your damage per shot and number of shots per action. The higher the X effect the more total damage potential, time spent, and bullets used; the biggest issue is that the additional damage is rounded down AND each shot is subject to enemy defenses. The more shots, the more damage is lost, potentially decreasing your damage output if you choose a higher shot-count than your base power can support. X2 is the best overall, but the other effects may have a niche in more creative builds, spreading Tranquilizer around for example.

Critical rate Up is great, more damage overall, no negatives.

Acid is ok, "poisons" enemies, no negatives, but it's not a significant source of damage.

First can be extremely useful even if it doesn't increase your damage. No negatives.

Heat and Frost... conditionally increase or reduce damage based on enemy resistances. There is almost no reason to use these, save your tools. The only time I could imagine recommending this is if you were playing a no modification challenge run or something.

Cyanide... useless. If you have Cyanide you shouldn't need Cyanide. Obtained too late in EX mode.

Counter Attack... worse than useless. Your damage output should never rely on taking hits. Wastes time, interrupts movement.

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There are only a handful of effects that directly improve your ability to deal damage without hindering you in some way. The others are just novelties, and you won't have access to many of them in a normal game, so they aren't even a consideration. You will only need 3 slots to make a great weapon, beyond that, you're just micro-managing.

In an attempt to cut through the bulls*** and actually answer the question being asked I will offer these suggestions for the latter half of a new game file.

SG550 (upgrade to 5 slots) Easily carries you through
Double Action, Burst, First, Tranquilizer, X2

transition to G3A3 with 3 or 4 slots at the end of the game if you feel that it is necessary
Double Action, Burst, X2, and any of First, Tranquilizer, Acid

Alternatively, upgrade to a machinegun
MP5PDW (upgraded ?)
Double Action, (Burst or Random), X2, and whatever you like (Tranquilizer, First, Acid,...).

User Info: Raycon

Raycon
6 months ago#8
Perin Valin posted...

I actually recommend the SG550 to most new players in a fresh game


Yes! I love that gun. I did end up switching to a junk weapon on my most recent EX-game run, but it just feels like a nice balance of stats for your first game. It's rewarding to see I'm not crazy, and that it might be a pretty solid gun after all. =' )
I must have looked a fool playing with a backwards DS, teary eyed solving a Sudoku puzzle -Lordx718

User Info: Perin Valin

Perin Valin
6 months ago#9
Yes, but, is this evidence that you are sane ....

or that I am crazy ?

User Info: Raycon

Raycon
6 months ago#10
Do the two have to be mutually exclusive?

= O

Amusingly enough, the topic where I saw the chart indicating RoFx3 yielded the most overall damage was immediately followed with a post by you providing the exact same information on why it was wrong. XD
I must have looked a fool playing with a backwards DS, teary eyed solving a Sudoku puzzle -Lordx718
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