• Topic Archived
You're browsing the GameFAQs Message Boards as a guest. Sign Up for free (or Log In if you already have an account) to be able to post messages, change how messages are displayed, and view media in posts.
This topic contains spoilers - you can click, tap, or highlight to reveal them
  1. Boards
  2. Dragon Quest XI S: Echoes of an Elusive Age - Definitive Edition
  3. Comparing a plot point of DQXI to Final Fantasy 3/VI *SPOILERS for both games*

User Info: TriforceBun

TriforceBun
4 weeks ago#1
Spoilers for Act 2 ahead! If you don't know what "Act 2" means in the context of DQXI, please turn back now.

So Final Fantasy 3 (6) and Dragon Quest XI both deploy a similar storytelling device around the half-way point: a calamity hits the world and scatters the party members, and much of the second half of the game revolves around regrouping and finding hope again.

While I'm greatly enjoying DQXI, FF3 is my all-time favorite RPG, and my second-favorite game, so I was pretty excited when I reached this point in DQXI. It's almost like a modernized take on that situation from FF3. I thought it might be fun to compare what both games did from a storytelling perspective and see the strengths of each.

WHAT BOTH DID RIGHT:

-The mid-game Apocalypse is really a neat trick all-around. Not only does it succeed in shifting the atmosphere, but it rekindles interest by having the player reach their lowest point for a while and stripping them of their power. It's also clever how both games will set up stories and arcs in the first half so that they can resolve them in the second.

-Re-collecting your scattered party members is a much stronger motivation than collecting a bunch of faceless MacGuffins. You wonder what they've been doing in the meantime, where they've been living, and in some cases, how the events have changed them (Erik, Jade, Veronica).

-Both games have a good balance of darkness with enough hope and charm to not feel depressing. Both involve real character deaths but also a fair amount of levity when necessary. The tone feels appropriately weighty but also not overtly bleak.

WHERE FF3 EXCELS:

-FF3 didn't just cast a dark shadow over the world, but reshaped the land mass entirely, making for a more interesting, shifted-around planet. While hope is still hard to come by in Erdrea, you don't get the impression that the world has changed THAT much. By and large, the Tree falling was more of a one-time disaster that killed some people, but the threat to the world is a bit more nebulous than Kefka frying dissenters with the Light of Judgment. When you get Rab back, there's a brief mention of souls not being able to move out of limbo, and I wish was made more clear as a known threat to humanity, as that's an extremely dire scenario that's just sort of glazed over.

-The music better reflects the state of the world in FF3. DQXI does have a new town theme and a bleak overworld theme during Heliodor, but it never really gets a cool new overworld song to inspire hope in your party like FF3's Searching for Friends. And I think the "bustling city" theme of DQXI really shouldn't play at all in Act 2. Some sort of middle ground song (maybe even the old village theme?) would've worked better, as it's crazy to hear that happy city theme in, say, Gondolia when there's a giant red orb in a sky full of dark purple clouds.

WHERE DQXI EXCELS:

-I rather like the interludes that were added in the interim. FF3's characters largely feel like they haven't done much since the cataclysm (with a few exceptions), while DQXI's guys have been on adventures in their own rights: Hendrik is atoning for his mistakes and taking care of people. Jade is now working alone to assist the vulnerable. Rab is training his mind and body for the eventual showdown. Sylvando struggles with hopelessness and discovers something about himself. Serena learns to be more self-reliant. And all of this stuff happens BEFORE you meet them!

-Having Hendrik join the Luminary as the first party member is a really clever move. It forces the two characters to bond and it gives you time to trust him as an ally. As a result, it doesn't feel like he's missed out on development since you get him so late in the game.

Any other FF3 fans down in here that enjoyed this part of DQXI?
You're lookin' sweet today! You're lookin' chubby today!

User Info: MarkMahWords

MarkMahWords
4 weeks ago#2
I love Act 2 because it reminds me so much of FF6 WOR, and I believe overall that DQ11 did the post-calamity section narratively better than FF6. The main reason being that the regaining all your party members is the story of Act 2 in DQ11, while in FF6, finding all your party members was mostly optional. For a game so character driven like FF6 to leave most of the character stories as optional in the most pivotal moment in the game is a missed opportunity in my eyes. DQ11 integrating the character search with the plot made the climax of the act feel that much more fulfilling.

I will agree that the music and lack of real geographical change in the overworld felt jarring, especially since they did it so well in areas like the Emerald Coast.

On an unrelated note, what reason do you have for referring FF6 primarily as FF3? Habit? Not to be rude, as I’m mostly curious.

User Info: TriforceBun

TriforceBun
4 weeks ago#3
MarkMahWords posted...
I love Act 2 because it reminds me so much of FF6 WOR, and I believe overall that DQ11 did the post-calamity section narratively better than FF6. The main reason being that the regaining all your party members is the story of Act 2 in DQ11, while in FF6, finding all your party members was mostly optional. For a game so character driven like FF6 to leave most of the character stories as optional in the most pivotal moment in the game is a missed opportunity in my eyes. DQ11 integrating the character search with the plot made the climax of the act feel that much more fulfilling.

I will agree that the music and lack of real geographical change in the overworld felt jarring, especially since they did it so well in areas like the Emerald Coast.

On an unrelated note, what reason do you have for referring FF6 primarily as FF3? Habit? Not to be rude, as I’m mostly curious.

That's an interesting perspective. While the character stories in FF3 are optional, I never really skip them anyway since that's where the bulk of the story is in the second half, seeing those characters get closure and such. Without them, the main plot is fairly straightforward ("go beat Kefka").

DQXI's character roundup is mandatory, but it's still somewhat episodic and only loosely linked to the main story ("go beat Mordegon"). Besides the Heliodor section, I think the most plot-relevant thing in Act 2 so far for me has actually been one not linked to a character recruit--getting the full tale about Dundrasil. Then again, I don't think I've made it to the "climax of the act" yet, although I'm pretty close! I just reached the Veronica section and whoa. That's another nifty trick DQXI pulls off, making you assume after your other party members that you'll just round everyone up after such a catastrophe and all will be well.

I still call FF6 "FF3" mostly because I played the game when it was known as that on the SNES and that specific title is the one that has the biggest connection for me. It does get a little confusing if I ever talk about multiple FF games at once (in which case I'll usually just default to "FF6"), but otherwise, I think in context it's pretty clear I don't mean the original Famicom FF3. Sort of like how in context one would know if the word "fly" is the action or the insect.

While I do wish we would've gotten, like, one more battle song, field song and town song apiece, I do appreciate the stark change in lighting all throughout Act 2. The sun-drenched vistas are a thing of the past and even towns that have had their problems solved still are under an overcast sky.
You're lookin' sweet today! You're lookin' chubby today!

User Info: Waraila

Waraila
4 weeks ago#4
While I do wish we would've gotten, like, one more battle song, field song and town song apiece, I do appreciate the stark change in lighting all throughout Act 2. The sun-drenched vistas are a thing of the past and even towns that have had their problems solved still are under an overcast sky.


DQ as a series has pretty much been static on their music selections. It's pretty similar across all the franchise... they don't really do different tracks per game... you play one game, you can pretty much know the theme that's going to play when you play the next game. Maybe with subtle differences, but the general theme is the same.

Still you have much much more to go... Act 3 will blow your mind I think :)

Also tockles .... don't neglect the tockles.... lots of tockles...
It's structured more like FF5, kinda.
World A
World B
World A+B

User Info: Lirishae

Lirishae
4 weeks ago#6
TriforceBun posted...
That's another nifty trick DQXI pulls off, making you assume after your other party members that you'll just round everyone up after such a catastrophe and all will be well.

Isn't it though? You're thinking to yourself that your party is fine because they have plot armor--and all of a sudden you find out it wasn't plot armor, it was a heroic sacrifice, all in one gut punch. I love it when games use our genre savviness against us like that.

TriforceBun posted...
I still call FF6 "FF3" mostly because I played the game when it was known as that on the SNES and that specific title is the one that has the biggest connection for me.

Yeah, it's hard to stop referring to things by names you've known for years, especially ones you've used since you were a child. I try to use both DW/DQ names when I know them, but I honestly can't remember some of the new localized names at times.
"Little scratches on people's hearts will be gone if they pat them from behind, but the humans don't know that." -Li'l Cactus
3DS FC: 0619-3174-3155

User Info: TriforceBun

TriforceBun
4 weeks ago#7
Lirishae posted...
Isn't it though? You're thinking to yourself that your party is fine because they have plot armor--and all of a sudden you find out it wasn't plot armor, it was a heroic sacrifice, all in one gut punch. I love it when games use our genre savviness against us like that.


Yeah, that's true. I was willing to just handwave that occurrence as something similar to how at the beginning of the game Erik and Luminary survive the jump from Heliodor, but it was nice (yet devastating) to get the full story once I reached Arboria.
You're lookin' sweet today! You're lookin' chubby today!

User Info: MarkMahWords

MarkMahWords
4 weeks ago#8
To elaborate on my perspective, some of the great coming together moments in FF6 WOR (character monologues before the final battle with Kefka, the individual character arcs wrapping up) can feel hollow or be completely missable. Because of some character arcs are naturally missable, the narrative in WOR had to take into account of the possibility that the player won't see some of those story chapters. We can talk all day about how "well that's the player's responsibility to seek out and explore those chapters themselves and if they miss them, well too bad" and for the most part I agree with that sentiment, but thats off-topic. The optional nature also means that each character story is isolated without much interaction with the other cast.

This is where I see it as a missed opportunity now after playing through DQ11. I would have loved to see characters in FF6 would have interacted with each other during each vignette much like how the party reacts in DQ11. Examples being when the party finds Jade or finds Serena and Veronica. (Party chats adds a lot of flavor to these segments too). The full Dundrasil section also benefits from having certain party members available there too. Small things like that add up in character development. There are some coming together moments in DQ11 that make for a great climax, but I won't spoil it for you :).

This is not a fault for FF6 on its own.I still think it's a wonderful game and the narrative difference in the WOR is still compelling and satisfying when you go through all the optional stuff. DQ11 just happened to change my mind on that plot design choice :)

User Info: JesseH21

JesseH21
4 weeks ago#9
You forgot one thing about the tree falling though. In the several months between the tree falling and the hero awakening, no new children were born and couldn't be conceived, meaning that unless yggdrasil was restored, the world was doomed as there was no way to repopulate.

User Info: Ozzy_98

Ozzy_98
4 weeks ago#10
I'm assuming the TC just got into act 2 when posting. It's not really a spoiler since it's not really "revealed" but the rest of the world isn't as bad off as the area you start. They still have a lot of death and monsters everywhere, but no fire and brimstone.

So that out of the way, there's another FF-ish plot that you've most likely not gotten to yet. It's end of act 2-beginning of act 3. But for people who have, Twins, were at least one sacrifices themselves. Only to be restored later. Doesn't that ring a bell a bit? Also, Rab is Yang and Cid's love child. Just sayin' I was half expecting him to jump off the whale at some point.

2019 RPGs-33
Latest TreasureOfTheSavageFrontier(10/3)Bloodstained(10/3) ChampionsOfKrynn(10/9)DeathKnightsOfKrynn(10/12)DarkQueenOfKrynn(10/16)
  1. Boards
  2. Dragon Quest XI S: Echoes of an Elusive Age - Definitive Edition
  3. Comparing a plot point of DQXI to Final Fantasy 3/VI *SPOILERS for both games*
  • Topic Archived

GameFAQs Answers